American Football

[pride_of_notts]

Giants rarely pick this high, and Gettleman strikes me as a good GM. I agree, I think they should go QB at 2. Alternatively could switch with the Broncos for a bulk of picks, and at 5 they still might be able to take the likes of Mayfield.

Bills could be another one who could trade up as well with Taylor gone to the Browns so there is definately an obvious need for a Quarterback I can see either Giants or Browns at 4 trading down It's definately going to be interesting to see how many of the QB's get taken in the top 5

 

[RavenBish]

Jets trading so much to go from 6 to 3 gives you a good indication that they know what's likely to be there - i.e. everyone in the league knows the Browns are taking Darnold - which means the Jets probably like 2 of Allen/Mayfield/Rosen enough to take whichever one the Giants (or a trade partner) doesn't take.

The thought of the Jets trading all that to stop the Browns taking Barkley at 4 would be the absolute 'how do these people get these jobs?' scenario that happens far too often in the NFL.

Bengals watch
Surprisingly solid offseason - securing Eifert with little drama on a low-risk deal and adding Cordy Glenn and Preston Brown. A couple of veteran roster cuts to save cap space (i.e. Lafell) and some other shmuck team to sign Bodine so I don't have to watch him for another season and...not terrible.

 

[Renegade]

Yeah, I like the what the Bengals have done, their offence is still really talented and is due for a bounce back season. The offensive line has been the big issue the past couple of seasons, but if Glenn performs and with improvement from Mixon and Ross to go along with AJ Green and potentially Eifert, I think you can compete for a wild card spot again.

After all of the quarterback movement this off-season, I still think the Jags will be kicking themselves that they are stuck with Bortles next season. A year of Tyrod, Keenum or Bradford would significantly have improved their chances of a Superbowl as the window is open for them to win right now and only one man is holding them back.

I don't see the Giants staying at #2, they have all of the bargaining power with weeks left to go until the draft, though they are an ideal landing spot for Barkley. Someone will try to hand them a couple of first rounders and more to grab Rosen and they'll probably not have to move too far down this year, much like the Colts. They have finally sorted out their issue at left tackle, Beckham will be back and their defence is still very talented. Another big bounce back candidate, especially if they get a bunch of early picks after trading down.

 

[Anon]

Jags never seemed to be in the Cousins stakes, Bradford could easily be a 20m black hole and barely see the field, Keenum is very risky because he's one year removed from being a 3rd choice fringe roster player and no longer has the OC he had in Minnesota. They would have had to give up practically an entire draft of picks to move up the draft for a top 3 QB too.

Plus, despite the previous seasons, Bortles played fine last season. Vastly cut down the interceptions, made plays with his legs (which was a surprise), and essentially didn't become the reason they'd lose games. Paired with an elite defense, it did well. I like the nod towards Tyrod as they could have saved themselves 8-9m, but they had to make a call on Bortles 5th year option before FA hit. Not to mention, the contract they subsequently got Bortles to sign gives them a realistic out after year one (in retrospect, I'm surprised Bortles signed it).

I found Jags FA business incredibly odd. Paid a tonne of money for a guard. Let a top 10-ish WR in Robinson walk and yet paid Moncrief (who's done precious little) 10m to be quite possibly their 4th best WR. ASJ was a good signing I feel, but then paid DJ Hayden a silly amount of money for a poor corner. Bizarre.

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Btw, if anyone wants to join an NFL forum with a small community of mostly UK-based long time fans, send me a PM. MagpieBee and I are there most of the time these days

 

[Renegade]

Whilst his statistics were fine, I think we have a vast disagreement on how he performed last year. I think they schemed the offence to completely stop Bortles from throwing games away. The first half of the season they did this by leaning everything on Fournette and the defence. When teams loaded the box to nullify Fournette, Bortles numbers improved in the second half of the season. He was still prone to making terrible decisions and even during his good games there were always a handful of throws that made everyone cringe and were lucky to not have been intercepted. This was despite his defence always putting him in a good position to succeed and taking pressure off his back. By simply having a bog standard starter (someone in that #16 to #25 range, which would include Tyrod, Bradford and Keenum) that takes care of the football, they wouldn't have had to put so much energy into offensive scheming designed to protect the team from Bortles doing something stupid.

I don't see the point in persevering with a liability just because he's cheap when the Jags have a Superbowl calibre roster now. Cut him after a year, so be it, it will still have been one year wasted and one year closer to losing the players that have been making up for Bortles' deficiencies. Tyrod was the obvious choice for me, but he'll be wasted on the Browns sadly.

 

[Anon]

I'm not saying Bortles is suddenly a top ten QB or the like, but he quite clearly had some individually good games - and in the playoffs too - where he aired it out more. In the others he largely didn't lose the game like he did the previous two years. Sure they scaled back his options, made it simpler for him, but clearly it worked as it suddenly became apparent he can run a bit too.

On Tyrod, Bortle's season and game plan was almost exactly the same as his. Tyrod doesn't gift the game, but he also barely throws the ball more than 20 yards. I don't think it's a coincidence that Bortles had a reasonable season when he finally had an RB to focus the defense... and the same goes with Tyrod and McCoy. The difference between Tyrod and Bortles on last season was not much at all. But Bortles comes with the stigma of being a high pick and having abysmal past seasons, whereas Tyrod was a low pick and since being at the Bills has always had an offense schemed around him - and an RB to lean on.

Tyrod's a great comparison, but I really don't think the difference between them is much at all (on the basis of last season).

 

[Renegade]

Yeah, but Tyrod has significantly outperformed him since becoming a starter overall. Bortles also had the best defence in the league and much better options at wideout (despite losing Robinson) than Tyrod last season. Whatever can be said about the lack of Taylor's playmaking ability as a passer, he's never been a liability. Bortles might be the single biggest liability at QB in the league. Taylor is the best running quarterback in the league too, not to be dismissed.

 

[Anon]

Yeah, but Tyrod has significantly outperformed him since becoming a starter overall. Bortles also had the best defence in the league and much better options at wideout (despite losing Robinson) than Tyrod last season. Whatever can be said about the lack of Taylor's playmaking ability as a passer, he's never been a liability. Bortles might be the single biggest liability at QB in the league.

Up until last season, I'd have 100% agreed with you. And if in 2018 Bortles reverts to pre-2017 Bortles, I'd agree that 2017 was a freak occurrence for Bortles. But on 2017 alone I'd very much put Tyrod and Bortles on a similar level.

 

[kieran_vale]

Brandin Cooks traded to the Rams for a first rounder (Rams 23rd pick) with us swapping a 4th rounder for their sixth also. Not sure how I feel about this but at least we got the first rounder we spent on him back and guess the Pats just thought with a contract extension looming best to move on. I really liked what he added to us though. Seemed like the first time in years we could really stretch the field with him.

I'm guessing the Pats are going to use this in some way whether it's a package to trade up to try or straight up use the pick and get a QB with Brady probably nearing the end.

Hot take time though is get on the Rams to win it all next year. That team is loaded near enough all over. I thought that after they paired Suh and Donald on the D-Line and this only helps them further offensively.

 

[Anon]

I highly doubt Brady would let the 1st be used to acquire a highly rated QB, if the fractures from last season are to be believed. Besides, most Pats fans (not you Kieran) think Brady's gonna play at an elite level til he's 50.

Love the trade for the Pats though. Acquire a proven good WR with a 1st, get great rookie contract use out of him, then trade him for a year for a slightly higher 1st (and change) and let someone else pay the big bucks in 2019. Saints will be happy with what they got too.

Rams will be happy as well. They're all in for this year but when the time comes to pay Donald, Gurley etc, they'll be able to move on from the other big signings too. Good business.

 

[kieran_vale]

I'm just guessing here but don't think Brady will have much sway on this especially as Kraft has said he's tasked BB with drafting a QB for if/when Brady retires. I suspect he will have two more years at the top level assuming he doesn't get any injuries then that may be it for him.

We do get back about $8m in cap relief which will be handy as well. Especially considering Gronk has made very thinly veiled comments at times about his contract (which I reckon a lot of his will he/won't he retire this off-season is coming from). With some of the contracts going out to receivers this off-season I'm not surprised the Pats balked at even considering an extension as an option.

 

[pride_of_notts]

I'm guessing the Pats are going to use this in some way whether it's a package to trade up to try or straight up use the pick and get a QB with Brady probably nearing the end.

I don't think Pats have enough draft capital to trade up to take one of the top QB's Rosen, Darnold or Allen all I feel will be taken in the top 3 and if the Giants trade down Bills are more likely they have better Draft picks to offer the Giants personally i feel the Pats could retool the Defence especially grabbing some Pass rush talent and an Offensive tackle is an option with them losing Solder and still they can grab a QB with one of there second round picks.

 

[Anon]

There's no chance they take a top QB... no chance, this isn't a realistic scenario at all. Look at what the Jets gave up to go from 6 to 3. Patriots would have to use both their firsts and a heap on top, to get into the top QB chatter.

The only one they'll have a shot at in the 1st might be Jackson, but from what I read about his strengths he seems the total antithesis to Brady.

 

[pride_of_notts]

There's no chance they take a top QB... no chance, this isn't a realistic scenario at all. Look at what the Jets gave up to go from 6 to 3. Patriots would have to use both their firsts and a heap on top, to get into the top QB chatter.

The only one they'll have a shot at in the 1st might be Jackson, but from what I read about his strengths he seems the total antithesis to Brady.

Jackson I am not convinced with at all personally I think He isn't a long term solution at QB especially the hits he will take and his frame never mind his arm talent has not really impressed me personally honestly I still think Jackson is a reach in the 1st round but someone is bound to do it. I still think Patriots will look later in the draft for a QB probably someone like Rudolph or Falk

 

[kieran_vale]

There's no chance they take a top QB... no chance, this isn't a realistic scenario at all. Look at what the Jets gave up to go from 6 to 3. Patriots would have to use both their firsts and a heap on top, to get into the top QB chatter.

The only one they'll have a shot at in the 1st might be Jackson, but from what I read about his strengths he seems the total antithesis to Brady.

While I agree ultimately you're right the draft value chart linked below gives an idea of the trade value the Pats would have to give up. Basically our top 3 picks gets us to fourth in the draft. I wouldn't do it and pretty much for the same reason I'm not too up on what the Jets did as it's relying on you liking not just one of them but pretty much all the top 3 QB's to give up that sort of haul for it as there's no guarantee of getting the one you want otherwise. I suspect someone like Kyle Lauletta would be the ideal QB for the Pats later on.

With Lamar Jackson I think it's been suggested a number of teams have asked him to do workouts as a receiver. Doesn't bode too well for his future as a QB.

Edit - I am making the assumption the Giants used their pick on Barkley if they don’t trade down.

https://www.drafttek.com/NFL-Trade-Value-Chart.asp?RequestTeam=ne

 

[Anon]

I guess I would never rule anything out in the NFL, but the packaging of high picks to go way up the draft order and bag a top rookie QB... is just so not a Patriots thing to do.

I found the requests for Jackson to work out as a receiver as borderline racist tbh. The guy has never played a WR snap in high school or college, and is mooted as being good enough for a mid/late 1st pick as a QB. Were he a late round QB I'd understand it far more, but why on earth would he say yes to a team who's asked him to do that? Terribly insulting.

 

[pride_of_notts]

Edit - I am making the assumption the Giants used their pick on Barkley if they don’t trade down.

https://www.drafttek.com/NFL-Trade-Value-Chart.asp?RequestTeam=ne

Barkley just seems a bad idea especially with the Giants having a Quarter back need Eli is 37 and there is no telling how long he will last Giants are in an ideal situation to get the future of the franchise and sit him and learn behind Eli if they don't they should trade back they would get a ton of picks no way should they take a Running Back

 

[Anon]

Giants are completely daft if they pass on a QB. This is supposedly a good class (bar a Luck etc) and the Giants never pick this high. They should only pass if they think the QBs bar the one Cleveland take are all truly rubbish.

I rate Gettleman as a GM and they picked up Solder too. They'd be dumb to pass on a QB!

 

[kieran_vale]

Guess this could go in a number of sections of the forum but appears to be a breaking story that Shad Khan is looking to buy Wembley Stadium. I’m going on a limb it’s not to move Fulham there so that leaves the Jags. Never been convinced at the idea of a London franchise and more I think on it the less I agree with it but could be interesting times ahead there. Way to shit on your fanbase in Jacksonville though just when they start getting relevant.

Oh and it’s the draft tonight. Am genuinely intrigued how this will play out. 2 picks in the first round for the Pats which we haven’t had since we drafted Hightower and Chandler Jones. Also with no consensus number 1 pick will be fascinating what the Browns do.

 

[pride_of_notts]

I think it definately pushes toward a London based franchise I can see why Khan would be interested Jacksonville is one of the smallest markets with a Franchise and he can upgrade it without a doubt moving to London

As for the Draft it definately looks like it will be a great one I would not be suprised to see a big trade especially for the Browns no 4 pick.

 

[kieran_vale]

Baker Mayfield to Cleveland then. What could possibly go wrong with that...

Giants will be happy though, am sure some QB needy team will be on the phone imminently to try and get Darnold.

Edit - nope they’ve used it on Barkley. Interesting! The Jets are going to end up with Darnold.

 

[pride_of_notts]

Barkley to the giants this seems like a dumb pick to me taking a running back no2

Mayfield I am ok with personally I would gone with Darnold but the Browns no4 pick value has gone through the roof

 

[kieran_vale]

I never thought the Giants were going QB but yeah to take a RB that high you are expecting Adrian Peterson level greatness. Am more surprised than anything they didn’t try and stock up by trading back.

 

[pride_of_notts]

I can understand them not taking a QB if they didn't love any but they could of got more value trading down Giants could be screwed once Eli retires Jets probably can't believe there luck with Darnold

Denzel Ward is interesting for the Browns as they did need a CB more than Defensive end some really suprising picks upto yet

 

[kieran_vale]

All I know is right now if you’re the Colts you’re absolutely loving this. The likes of Bradley Chubb and Nelson to choose from you can’t miss.

Edit - Chubb to Denver - great talent. Good luck with him and Von Miller.

 

[pride_of_notts]

Nelson is an excellent choice for me protecting Luck is a must and Nelson is the best on the board

 

[pride_of_notts]

bills trade up battle between the Josh's

 

[kieran_vale]

Josh Allen it is then. Guess the whole racist tweets thing which just miraculously appeared on draft day hasn’t hurt him.

Be interesting how it plays out for Rosen now. Arizona I would think are a prime candidate.

Am thinking the way it’s playing out that Lamar Jackson could fall into Pats territory.

 

[kieran_vale]

I thought the NFL had put the word out to the media previously to stop spoiling picks like Mayock just did. Either way great pick up for the Bears.

 

[pride_of_notts]

Yeah it seems the QB's are dropping down further than I expected As for Jackson I am not super high on him DT QB's rarely work out and his running scares me in a bad RG3 way