Bristol City vs Brentford

[TractorBoys]

I think we could have gone on to finish in the top half had we had a good summer. We've had the complete opposite unfortunately. Let hugely important squad players like JET and Cunningham go, not brought in anyone impressive apart from Kodjia who is still unproven. It's just been a wasted opportunity and a wasted summer pursuing unrealistic targets (up until now). We've done the opposite of what we did last summer and seem to have abandoned the transfer strategy that brought us so much success just last summer.The mood around the squad should have been full of positivty, but I just feel frustrated.

Three losses, nine goals conceded, Freeman out for 3 games, a far worse squad than we had last year. We need to act fast.

I still think you'll do alright, plumped for 18th in table predictions but wouldn't be surprised to see you as high as 12th-14th. I just think your opening two games were always going to be tough and I wouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater just yet!

TB

 

[MagpieBee]

Bryan had your right back on toast first half, Odebajo needs replacing IMO, and the bald bloke isn't the answer.

I thought that about Gray, that's why I was happy to dismiss us spending crazy money on Gray, but he was very clinical today. Finished well.

Yeah, club also accept Macca isn't the answer. Signed a guy from Anderlecht the other day, Maxime Collin, for £900k, but no idea how he'll fare yet.

 

[MagpieBee]

I still think you'll do alright, plumped for 18th in table predictions but wouldn't be surprised to see you as high as 12th-14th. I just think your opening two games were always going to be tough and I wouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater just yet!

TB

Agree. We had a bit of a bumpy start last year, against arguably "easier" teams, but it soon came together. You guys should be ok, but need a deeper squad. You wouldn't be able to have the number of injuries we do right now! (5 players out for the next 4 months or more, with a few other shorter term ones)

 

[Aaron-Bcfc]

Watching Gray in the flesh you can tell he's a classy player. It is however still a big no at that price.

I think that it's likely he isn't 100% fit still

Yeah that's a fair point actually

 

[toshj]

With wilbs it's seems that tarkowski had been all over him throughout the match, not to mention wilbs was punched in the side during the corner when he scored, or the forearm to the face he got later in the game

Fair enough on the hurts that Wilbraham took but he seemed fine and largely unhurt in his movements and actions throughout the rest of the game, in turn he broke someones nose! Loads on your forum agreeing it should have been a red too. Furthermore, you're allowed to be all over someone all game, that's largely the point if you're a centre back and is no suitable excuse for causing a player to have to leave the field permanently with a broken bone!

 

[City169]

Fair enough on the hurts that Wilbraham took but he seemed fine and largely unhurt in his movements and actions throughout the rest of the game, in turn he broke someones nose! Loads on your forum agreeing it should have been a red too. Furthermore, you're allowed to be all over someone all game, that's largely the point if you're a centre back and is no suitable excuse for causing a player to have to leave the field permanently with a broken bone!

Not excusing wilbrahim for it, however the punch to the side should equally be a red, and non stop shirt pulling a booking at the minimum, then if it doesn't stop then there would be a case for a red for 2 bookable offences.

 

[toshj]

Watching Gray in the flesh you can tell he's a classy player. It is however still a big no at that price.

Gray actually looked a little sulky for the first part of the game, his body language was off. Combining the fact that he was played out of position and has had all this uncertainty the last fortnight about his future, I thought he had a very positive effect on the game. He had a hand in the first three goals (maybe the fourth too, can't remember the build up) and that's the most important attribute a forward can have - the team creating more opportunities as a whole when a specific player is on the pitch totally trumps how many goals that player scores.

Is he worth the price we've been quoting (£7.5m + £2m in add ons)? Nope, but he's worth an awful lot to our team and potential success in this division, plus if we do sell him to Hull then we'll be strengthening a rival.

Bryan had your right back on toast first half, Odebajo needs replacing IMO, and the bald bloke isn't the answer.

I thought that about Gray, that's why I was happy to dismiss us spending crazy money on Gray, but he was very clinical today. Finished well.

Alan McCormack is very much a utility player and was having a hard time of it today. Was getting roasted in the first half, but it was more the fact that you guys were doubling up on him whilst also him receiving now support from the midfield that was causing it. That all changed with the red card and we were more than a little fortunate with the timing of it!

 

[Judge Dredd]

Gray actually looked a little sulky for the first part of the game, his body language was off. Combining the fact that he was played out of position

What position did he play today out of interest?

 

[toshj]

What position did he play today out of interest?

Played wide right, forward of a general wide midfielder and not really a winger either. I understand he filled this role quite frequently at Luton, but we've spent the last year moulding him into a leading the line centre forward and he's never played wide right in our system. Thought he did well but neither he or Gogia (wide left) tracked back at all and we were left exposed throughout the first half.

 

[Ciderup]

So what did people think of the new 3/4 Ashton Gate then? Bees fans as well.

 

[Judge Dredd]

Played wide right, forward of a general wide midfielder and not really a winger either. I understand he filled this role quite frequently at Luton, but we've spent the last year moulding him into a leading the line centre forward and he's never played wide right in our system. Thought he did well but neither he or Gogia (wide left) tracked back at all and we were left exposed throughout the first half.

Yeah, he played wide right in a 4-2-3-1/4-3-3 almost exclusively for us in the last 18 months of his time here, although given almost Cristiano Ronaldo levels of freedom to get in the box at will. It's his best position IMHO as it means he doesn't have to play with his back to goal much, all of his best runs of goalscoring form with us came from a wide position. Although you do have to accept that the right back will end up exposed an awful lot (probably not ideal when you have just lost your best right back!!) - maybe something we could get away with in the Conference but riskier at your level.

 

[JoshBCFC]

Agreed, he was shite and nearly all of our play was going through him. In all honesty though Joe's attitude really annoyed me after the red. He didn't seem interested at all.

TBH it looked like he was exhausted. He was constantly the running the whole game, even more so after the red. Plus he probably wasn't 100% fit. We definitely need another RWB.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but I think your comment here may be the blindness of an enraged fan. Bristol City fans were baying for blood at every challenge by a Brentford player after the red card. This particular challenge you mentioned was 100% fine, completely got the ball and it was fine. But as aggrieved fans tend to when they're unhappy with the ref, they think everything is going against them. To be honest I thought you had more of a penalty shout later in the game.

Stroud is an awful referee, we've had him go against us loads of times and he's phenominally frustrating. That said, Dean got studded in the face! It looked accidental but it was a horrible challenge, even most of the posters on OTIB think it was a sending off. Also thought Wilbraham was lucky to stay on the pitch after that elbow on Tarkowski... seeing as he broke the guys nose!

I couldn't really see that Kodija penalty shout, but looked a bit like a penalty. I did say to my mate that i bet that Freeman's red will get resicnded... with Wilbraham getting suspended. From my view I couldn't really see that well, but it did look like a sending-off.

Not baiting you here, but what were you expecting your momentum to achieve?

IMO (and it's only my opinion!) away to Sheff Wed and home to Brentford would have played out exactly like it has, two defeats.

Admittedly Luton result is a suckerpunch and could have been used a platform for today had you won.

TBH we would've beaten Brentford 3-1/4-1 if we hadn't have got Freeman sent off, trust me.

It looked more like Tarkowski walked into the elbow to be fair, nothing malicious in it.

The penalty shout, we will see tonight, but my initial reaction was stone wall penalty. In all honesty, most of the cheers/jeers were ironic. Them signing 'off off off' after every 50/50 ball weren't in seriousness.

I read your forum yesterday, and I seen a lot of them were annoyed he was refereeing the game, and I agree, he's a shocking referee. I hope he never sets foot in AG again.

I would agree, Keith Stroud is utter shit. Worse than the refs at Sunday League level.


I feel we did really well for the first 35 minutes. Kodija got it underway with a great show of pace, strengh, and lethal finishing to score. He looked really promising today, and i think it was a really weird decision to take him off instead of Wilbraham for Agard. They then equalised with a mistake from Hamer. He came out, then tried to go back, and saved the first shot, but the ball landed at Judge's feet, and he was always going to score. We then should've scored 3 more times, Wilbraham missing two and Kodija missing one. Despite the goal, I seriously doubt Wilbraham is Championship quality. He is too slow, and we definitely need a new striker, which unfortunately won't be Gayle, and probably not Gray. Then came Freeman's tackle. As SC and JJH have said, the linesman didn't think it was a red card. I think it was probably more the linesman wanted to speak to the ref about it, to try and confirm it wasn't a red. Sadly he still gave it, which i don't think was the correct decision. I haven't seen a replay yet, so when i do i will probably be able to say for definite, but based on my view it was a bad challenge and should've been a yellow. Dean (AKA c***) looked unconcious, and that probably made Stroud say it was a red, which is stupid tbh, he should judge it on how bad the foul was, not how bad the player was injured. Obviously he was fine and 3 seconds after Freeman was sent off he somehow managed to get up again, much to the shock of everyone. He was definitely dead! Oh wait, he was just being a complete soulless twatted shitbag to get Freeman sent off. What a fucking messed-up bitch.


Anyway, i'll stop talking about that now before I get myself a forum ban. Obviously Brentford equalized, with a goal I couldn't really see, but understand was an own-goal by Williams. It looked like Hamer made a howler,but I haven't seen a replay yet. Just after that Wilbraham broke one of the Brentford players noses. Obviously nobody picked up that Stroud had made another howler (wonder why, we aren't biased ) . Wish that lad a speedy recovery. We started the second half well, but Williams failed to challenge Andre Gray quick enough, allowing him to score. They put the game to bed with a goal which really only came about because of the numbers difference. I think from then on we were just too tired, and although Wes Burns looked promising, we couldn't force anything.

Joe Bryan got MOTM somehow, which wasn't a good decision IMO, he was good in the first half, but not great in the second half. For me it would be between Kodija and Ayling. Probably Ayling scraping it because he played the full 90. He got an assist for the first goal, and looked as comfortable as ever playing out the back.

Based on the first 35 mins of that game, we'll be fine in the Championship. We do need squad depth but the only signing we need to get permanently is a striker. Then, we can get some more squad depth via the loan market. Hamer didn't look good today: but neither did Fielding vs Wednesday. Hopefully we can be a little tighter in defence, and then we should hopefully have either Hamer or Fielding peforming well, week in, week out.

 

[Ciderup]

A few surprising stats there!

 

[Aaron-Bcfc]

I wouldn't worry about getting a forum ban for calling a player a shitbag Josh

 

[JoshBCFC]

So what did people think of the new 3/4 Ashton Gate then? Bees fans as well.

It's good, I quite like it. Disappointingly no working scoreboard (not surprising given the one we have at the minute probably cost a fiver) , and no big TV in the ground but oh well. The concourse just needs a few shelves and table, and it will be great. It's an exciting time to be a City fan.

Although TBH i will be moving back into the West Stand once it is reopened, being behind a goal doesn't really suit a small person like me, when everyone stands up I can barely see xD.

 

[JoshBCFC]

I wouldn't worry about getting a forum ban for calling a player a twatted shitbag Josh

 

[Ciderup]

It's good, I quite like it. Disappointingly no working scoreboard (not surprising given the one we have at the minute probably cost a fiver) , and no big TV in the ground but oh well. The concourse just needs a few shelves and table, and it will be great. It's an exciting time to be a City fan.

Although TBH i will be moving back into the West Stand once it is reopened, being behind a goal doesn't really suit a small person like me, when everyone stands up I can barely see xD.

Might be worth trying to move towards the corner for a few games if there's space. No issue there at all, even with the whole Dolman immediately to our right.

 

[Ciderhead]

Thought it looked a red myself. Completely unintentional, but he basically kicked him in the face, the ref had no option really. About the only thing he did get right mind!

Other than that, JJ's writeup is spot on. Disappointing to lose but the red changed the game completely, performance up until then was very promising. On that basis, this team will have no problems competing this season.

Kodjia looks some player. Pace, power, skill, can pick a pass. All he lacked was the finishing touch, could and should have had a hat-trick today. Was baffled when he was brought off, with him up there we still looked a real threat on the counter, Agard sadly had nowhere near the same presence.

 

[toshj]

Dean (AKA c***) looked unconcious, and that probably made Stroud say it was a red, which is stupid tbh, he should judge it on how bad the foul was, not how bad the player was injured. Obviously he was fine and 3 seconds after Freeman was sent off he somehow managed to get up again, much to the shock of everyone. He was definitely dead! Oh wait, he was just being a complete soulless twatted shitbag to get Freeman sent off. What a fucking messed-up bitch.

Just to point something out about this, as the general opinion amongst BCFC fans is that Dean somehow conned the ref into giving the red card. Dean got wiped out in mid air by a high foot to the face. Dean's feet were off the floor as he was going in for the header, and he ended up landing on his back from a fall of quite a height. Our physio was on the pitch like lightning and, due to the nature of getting kicked in the face and landing heavily on his back, the first thing the physio would have said is "Don't move at all, don't move your head, your neck, your back, arms or legs. Stay completely still until I've assessed you" as the first and immediate concern would be to rule out any spinal injuries. Then he'd ask Dean a question as to how he felt before checking his neck, eyes and potentially ears. Dean's a pretty tough player - I've seen him get knocked out but carry on playing when he's come to - and in all honesty, if the physio hadn't have told him to lie still he probably would have got up and squared up to Freeman!

Then before the player is allowed to get up the physio will run through a check list, starting with wiggling toes and fingers before working up to larger and more spine-intensive movements to rule out any (serious) injury. Given the collection of nerves in the spine, it's very easily for a serious back or neck injury to occur without the player feeling it, particularly as a footballer's body likely has relatively high levels of adrenaline throughout the game which would reduce any immediate pain felt, so the physio would need to go through a vital step by step process to make sure the player is ok - even if Dean spent the whole time saying "I'm fine, let me get up" the physio wouldn;t have stood him up.

In my experience, when a player goes down and tries to con the referee into a yellow or red card, they're normally rolling all over the ground as if they've been shot. Dean lay completely still as instructed and was only allowed to get up once the physio was satisfied.

 

[TractorBoys]

WTF are some of you and Cotterill talking about? It was an absolute stonewall sending off lol.

 

[Veggie Legs]

Complete agree with TB on the red card, can't believe some people are saying it was a bad decision.

 

[toshj]

Two other points:

1) thought we got a fair slice of luck with our first goal, as the ball appeared to bounce up onto Judge's arm as he got it under control. Ref wouldn't have seen it, but I looked straight at the linesman instead of celebrating and held my breath!

2) not meaning to be inflammatory, but BCFC need to be stronger and more wise once the red card came out. Last season we went down to ten men early at home to Birmingham, who scored from the resulting penalty, but he kept our shape before equalising and getting a point. City today seemed to really respond badly to the red, and think this comes directly from Cotterill. Instead of getting the players sorted, keeping them calm and in at half time with the lead, he went ballistic at the ref, was screaming and ranting, and this can only have a negative impact on the players. It was an opportunity for Cotterill to sort the situation out and be a leader, but instead he seemed to sulk and throw a wobbly, therefore unsettling Bristol's players.

 

[JJH]

Just to point something out about this, as the general opinion amongst BCFC fans is that Dean somehow conned the ref into giving the red card. Dean got wiped out in mid air by a high foot to the face. Dean's feet were off the floor as he was going in for the header, and he ended up landing on his back from a fall of quite a height. Our physio was on the pitch like lightning and, due to the nature of getting kicked in the face and landing heavily on his back, the first thing the physio would have said is "Don't move at all, don't move your head, your neck, your back, arms or legs. Stay completely still until I've assessed you" as the first and immediate concern would be to rule out any spinal injuries. Then he'd ask Dean a question as to how he felt before checking his neck, eyes and potentially ears. Dean's a pretty tough player - I've seen him get knocked out but carry on playing when he's come to - and in all honesty, if the physio hadn't have told him to lie still he probably would have got up and squared up to Freeman!

Then before the player is allowed to get up the physio will run through a check list, starting with wiggling toes and fingers before working up to larger and more spine-intensive movements to rule out any (serious) injury. Given the collection of nerves in the spine, it's very easily for a serious back or neck injury to occur without the player feeling it, particularly as a footballer's body likely has relatively high levels of adrenaline throughout the game which would reduce any immediate pain felt, so the physio would need to go through a vital step by step process to make sure the player is ok - even if Dean spent the whole time saying "I'm fine, let me get up" the physio wouldn;t have stood him up.

In my experience, when a player goes down and tries to con the referee into a yellow or red card, they're normally rolling all over the ground as if they've been shot. Dean lay completely still as instructed and was only allowed to get up once the physio was satisfied.

I apologise.

Having watched it back several times on the Football League Show, I am now aware that in no way was he attempting to con the referee.

 

[Alex_BCFC]

Red was clear as day - not intentional but just horrible. And personally I would have sent off Wilbraham too for his naughty flailing elbow.

As for the game...good performance until the sending off. We would have won comfortably I think without it.

After that Brentford were very good at picking us off - we have real issues at the back right now. Hamer and Derek don't look good enough. Fredericks not quite there yet...Now without Freeman we have such a small squad that we will struggle to deal without him for three games.

Plenty of positives - Kodija very good and Bryan superb in the first half.

Finally, I can actually see Cotterill going early. He seems highly strung and not getting backing from the board on transfers? Combine that with a bad start and you never know...

 

[Jack Synx]

We were outstanding until the red card. We would have won the game 3-1! But for the red card, it was stonewall even though no intent. I just think that with one more striker and a bit of squad disapline we will be fine as for cotterill as soon as the red card it felt like he gave up on the game and just though fuck it lets get onto Wednesday. Personally I can see him going in the next month sorry.
Squad ratings
Hamer 4/10
Bryan 6/10
Fredericks 6/10
Williams 5/10
Flint 6/10
Ayling 7.5/10
smith 7/10
Pack 4/10
Wilbraham 6.5/10
Kodjia 8/10
Any disagreements ??
Sorry don't know the Brentford players

 

[Heisenberg20]

Thought we were brilliant up until the Red card but felt Brentford were also capable of scoring at any moment aswell.
I appreciate a lot of fellow City fans optimism but if we keep that team and keep the way we are playing which is too open wewill get battered most weeks if I am honest.

Brentford looked a good team to me, Diagouraga was the most impressive I thought and is exactly who we need in our side.
At times we are very very naive and thats down to our inexperience at this level but the players are going to need to learn fast otherwise we will be back to the third tier again before long.
If we keep losing I can see Cotterill walking if I'm honest.
Very similar to the 1998/1999 season so far.

 

[BCFC Jordan]

At least we'll have the prettiest stadium in League One.

 

[JJH]

We were outstanding until the red card. We would have won the game 3-1! But for the red card, it was stonewall even though no intent. I just think that with one more striker and a bit of squad disapline we will be fine as for cotterill as soon as the red card it felt like he gave up on the game and just though fuck it lets get onto Wednesday. Personally I can see him going in the next month sorry.
Squad ratings
Hamer 4/10
Bryan 6/10
Fredericks 6/10
Williams 5/10
Flint 6/10
Ayling 7.5/10
smith 7/10
Pack 4/10
Wilbraham 6.5/10
Kodjia 8/10
Any disagreements ??
Sorry don't know the Brentford players

I'm not just singling you out Synxy, but for everyone who has said that Hamer was poor today, why? What could he really have done about any of the goals?

Only 6/10 for Bryan Jack? Harsh, mate!

At least we'll have the prettiest stadium in League One.

Cheer up laa, we're two games into a 46 game season. We'll be fine.

 

[BCFC Jordan]

Cheer up laa, we're two games into a 46 game season. We'll be fine.

The summer window drained all my enthusiasm. The opening three games of the season have just cemented that feeling. Hope things change quickly.

 

[Luke_ciderhead]

You doom and gloom merchants will be eating your words! Loving being back in the championship and can't wait to see our team of champions rise to the challenge and adapt to this higher level! Shades of 98-99? Cotterill to resign? Pft. If anyone wants a little wager that we won't go back down, id be game.