FA Cup Final - Man United vs Crystal Palace

[JJ1532]

? Both are now confirmed in the Europa League.

Not quite. Southampton are now through to the group stages. West Ham have to enter at the 3rd qualifying round, which means their season will start at the end of July most likely. Their players who are heading to the Euros will be finishing that tournament and rolling pretty much straight into pre-season training and preparation for the qualifying round. Not ideal.

 

[JoshBCFC]

West Ham have to go through all the early qualifying though don't they? I get the feeling they'd have rather avoided the Europa League to be honest.

Not quite. Southampton are now through to the group stages. West Ham have to enter at the 3rd qualifying round, which means their season will start at the end of July most likely. Their players who are heading to the Euros will be finishing that tournament and rolling pretty much straight into pre-season training and preparation for the qualifying round. Not ideal.

Ah, ok.

 

[Stevencc]

Get Van Gaal 5 year deal now!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...to-be-appointed-as-man-utd-manager-this-week/

 

[Christian Slater]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...to-be-appointed-as-man-utd-manager-this-week/

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36351371
That makes it official.

 

[The Reverend Skyblue]

That was a shite final game bar the last 15minutes.
Crystal Palaces tactics were absurd, get to a final then sit deep and play one up front totally isolated.
Pardew should be sacked on today's tactics alone, a very average Man U side were there for the taking, but Pardew decided to sit back and try for a flukey one nil. They should of attaked them down the flanks , they have the players to do so, but no he had other ideas and we hardly saw Zaha and Bolasi.
4/10 for entertainment. If united fans think the style of football will improve under Mourhino they have had their heads in the sand the last decade

 

[G-Dragon]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...to-be-appointed-as-man-utd-manager-this-week/

Disgrace! A cup winning manager being treated in such a way, football lost today.

 

[Stevencc]

Disgrace! A cup winning manager being treated in such a way, football lost today.

You need to sharpen up those trolling skills for next season, mate.

 

[G-Dragon]

You need to sharpen up those trolling skills for next season, mate.

No troll mate. Dat be facts.

 

[Skinner]

Shit game. Shit reffing. Former Brighton scores the winner. The worst attempt at a comeback you'll see. And the cup goes to the most wanky fans going (discluding Arsenal)

 

[Stevencc]

Shit game. Shit reffing. Former Brighton scores the winner. The worst attempt at a comeback you'll see. And the cup goes to the most wanky fans going (discluding Arsenal)

Chin up sweetheart

 

[Nilsson]

Anyone for a dance?

 

[Nilsson]

Jesse Lingard, what a great story that is.

 

[Skinner]

Chin up sweetheart

It was always going to mean more to us than it was to you. To you, it's just an FA cup, and your fans from India to Norway will be happy. But it makes us south Londoners sick to our stomachs.

 

[Nilsson]

It was always going to mean more to us than it was to you. To you, it's just an FA cup, and your fans from India to Norway will be happy. But it makes us south Londoners sick to our stomachs.

Oh my. Lose with some dignity.

Mata enjoyed Pardew's dad dancing
https://twitter.com/BBCSporf/status/734094233854869504

 

[Jockney]

Oh my. Lose with some dignity.

Mata enjoyed Pardew's dad dancing
https://twitter.com/BBCSporf/status/734094233854869504

He's right, though. I can't believe I'm agreeing with a Palace fan, but he's right.

 

[Nilsson]

He's right, though. I can't believe I'm agreeing with a Palace fan, but he's right.

Winning the cup would mean more to a smaller club, what a revelation. If United would've lost the fans would've been just as gutted and had the added annoyance of most fans from other clubs laughing at them and taking the piss. For the younger generation this will have been their first FA Cup win (I certainly wasn't old enough in 2004 to enjoy it properly) and for a kid who's supported the club his whole life and been at the club since he was 8 to grab a stunning winner in extra time when we're down to 10 men makes it extra special.

 

[Jockney]

Winning the cup would mean more to a smaller club, what a revelation. If United would've lost the fans would've been just as gutted and had the added annoyance of most fans from other clubs laughing at them and taking the piss. For the younger generation this will have been their first FA Cup win (I certainly wasn't old enough in 2004 to enjoy it properly) and for a kid who's supported the club his whole life and been at the club since he was 8 to grab a stunning winner in extra time when we're down to 10 men makes it extra special.

I think you've probably made my point more effectively for me than I could have. I fail to see how United fans would have been 'just as gutted' as Palace fans when their team has won trophies at a ratio that must being approaching 2 a season since 1993. Most new United fans, regular or not, will never appreciate success like the rest of us do because it is a club that attracts casuals and people who feel entitled to success (see also Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and more recently Man City).

 

[Christian Slater]

People invest in their teams to the same degree no matter the stature of the club. Someone doesn't have more emotion because they support a smaller club, or because a bigger club attracts casual fans.

 

[Nilsson]

I think you've probably made my point more effectively for me than I could have. I fail to see how United fans would have been 'just as gutted' as Palace fans when their team has won trophies at a ratio that must being approaching 2 a season since 1993. Most new United fans, regular or not, will never appreciate success like the rest of us do because it is a club that attracts entitled people and casuals (see also Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and more recently Man City).

"attracts entitled people"

They'd be just as gutted because losing a final is a gutting thing for any fan. I'm sure Palace fans had a fair amount of casuals yesterday too. Generalizing an entire fanbase is boring.

 

[JimJams]

Na Slater, of course the stature matters. That doesn't mean supporters of smaller clubs have more emotion or whatever just that they will value things differently and so it will be bigger for them than it is for you. Fans don't lose a final and feel the same emotions every time. I imagine Liverpool fans felt a lot worse losing the CL final to Milan than they did losing the league cup final this season to Man City and the Europa league defeat probably falls in between somewhere. Nobody is going to feel the same way to those losses.
Had Utd lost this final I'm sure they wouldn't have felt as down s Palace fans because Utd fans will know their chance of winning something will be just around the corner. Palace fans won't.
Your equivalent situation would probably be losing the CL final to them losing the FA cup final. Although even then you've been in more CL finals than Palace have in any comp since the last time you two met in a cup final.

 

[Christian Slater]

Losing a final feels just as bad no matter the trophy. Obviously this is subjective, but the argument you are presenting is based on your preconceptions of "big club" fans.

 

[JimJams]

No not really. I can base it on my own feeling for Leicester. Losing the League cup final to Spurs was bad. If we'd stumbled and lost the league to them this season it'd have been a shitload worse. Not 2 finals by comparison, but different levels of competition.
So next year when we inevitably get to the CL final (!) if we were to lose I know it'd feel worse than when we lost to Spurs. A lot worse. Because the likelihood of doing it again is smaller.

 

[Christian Slater]

Your argument is based on hypothetical emotional responses. I've seen United lose every trophy, sucks just the same.

As I said, this is subjective to the person.

 

[JimJams]

Fair enough. I think you're an oddbod.

 

[Nilsson]

Your argument is based on hypothetical emotional responses. I've seen United lose every trophy, sucks just the same.

As I said, this is subjective to the person.

Agreed. I've never seen United lose a final and thought "who cares, we'll just win it again next year". If we failed to win a league title under Ferguson I'd always be confident we'll come back stronger the following year, because it's a marathon and Fergie was the best, but never a final.

 

[JimJams]

I didn't say you'd think 'Who cares?' just that the disappointment of losing a domestic final wouldn't be the same as the disappointment of losing a European final for example. The number of times you play (or would expect to play) in those finals plays a part.

 

[Jockney]

"attracts entitled people"

They'd be just as gutted because losing a final is a gutting thing for any fan. I'm sure Palace fans had a fair amount of casuals yesterday too. Generalizing an entire fanbase is boring.

We can only talk in generalisations, but clubs with the sort of all-encompassing capital that Man United have attract far more transient and casual support than a club like Crystal Palace, which has a more intimate connection with its community.

The 'it's all subjective' argument is reductive only if we're being kind. The victory doesn't mean as much to Man United fans as it would have Palace, and equally the defeat is far more keenly felt by Palace than it would have been by Man United. That there is now an oddbod somewhere in Stretford (or Thailand, haw, haw) framing a picture of Jesse Lingard to put next to school portraits of his kids is irrelevant to the broader truth.

 

[Jockney]

Nilsson, you talk about losing cup finals like a supporter of a football league club would do if their side had missed out on the play-offs. I think that's the crucial difference between supporters of top 4 clubs and most everybody else. The menatlity is so completely different.

 

[Nilsson]

 

[JimJams]

That was quite an incredible foul.