General Election 2015

[The Southbank]

How do you explain Liverpool, Manchester and London then? The map is basically, urban, intelligent people who integrate with different people and vote Labour V backward, posh six fingered, selfish c*** who vote Tories.

That's my view anyway,...

How do you explain places like Portsmouth, which have large working class areas, yet voted Tory in their numbers?

 

[Captain Scumbag]

Isn't this a little bit of a red herring, seeing as the SNP had candidates in only Scottish seats. We're not really comparing apples with apples here?

It's not a perfect like-for-like comparison for reasons covered, but I think it draws attention to how badly a party suffers under FPTP when its fairly sizeable support is spread thin rather than highly concentrated in particular areas.

It's not a new problem. It's been known for years. And I suppose I'm as guilty as the next bloke insofar that I tend to turn a blind eye when it suits me and whinge when it doesn't.

Quite interesting to see a lot of non-Conservative and pro-EU people now moaning about the lack of PR, though. Not sure if they realise that applying something like the D'Hondt method to Friday's result would almost certainly have resulted in a Tory-UKIP coalition. Kudos to them if they do.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

Quite interesting to see a lot of non-Conservative and pro-EU people now moaning about the lack of PR, though. Not sure if they realise that applying something like the D'Hondt method to Friday's result would almost certainly have resulted in a Tory-UKIP coalition. Kudos to them if they do.

Having discussed the results with various people I know who are anti Tory and bemoaning FPTP, when I suggested that a PR election would have likely resulted in a Tory/Ukip coalition - it did not go down well...

I would be up for looking again at some electoral reform, PR would make more sense for the multi party system we now have. But no system is perfect. Was it Churchill who said 'democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the others'?

 

[mnb089mnb]

Quite interesting to see a lot of non-Conservative and pro-EU people now moaning about the lack of PR, though. Not sure if they realise that applying something like the D'Hondt method to Friday's result would almost certainly have resulted in a Tory-UKIP coalition. Kudos to them if they do.

I'm still in favour of a more proportional approach despite that result - obviously I expect people would have voted differently if it weren't FPTP. I'd personally like to see more coalition governments, it'd be nice if politicians felt they could work together more.

In addition something I'd never considered until this election is the affect pre-election polling can have on the outcome of a vote. They're even banned in some countries. This is an interesting (but long) post on the subject https://opendemocracy.net/ourkingdo...sts-were-wrong-ed-miliband-was-nowhere-near-b

We could do with doing something about our electoral system, but I've little idea of what that could be. Democracy is hard.

 

[Ian_Wrexham]

The situation is grim, good hearted pinkos. Slytherin has the quaffle and Winter is Coming. But let us find the silver lining in this massive piss smelling cloud. From crisis comes opportunity. Tis always darkest just before dawn. Such a shoeing will force the Labour braintrust to look into the mirror. To reevaluate. To ponder what the party has been, what it is, what it could be, what it should be. From this grim crucible will emerge a new generation of leaders and thinkers, men and women of great strength, charisma, daring and imagination. Amongst them will be a new Lincoln, Alexander, Asoka or Mandela. A titan to liberate us from the choking tyranny of dismal consensus, to build a better Britain, a better world.

"Hunt said the Labour party needed to appeal to the “John Lewis community” "

Oh.

Tristam "Scab" Hunt is the very essence of Why Labour Is Shit And Has To Die.

 

[Martino Knockavelli]

It's a novel variation on the theme of John Lewis stores (and the several things they represent) as icon and bellwether of bad provincial urban regeneration, at least.

 

[The Alex]

Tristram is a top bloke

 

[TractorBoys]

Farage remains leader, resignation rejected!

Also, Sugar quits his support for Labour: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-32692668 Echoes so many peoples thoughts, they need to appeal to the people running small businesses in addition to just the people that work for them businesses - Blair and the like back this thought process. Cannot see Labour forming another government for a very long time unless they manage to understand that way of thinking over the next 5 years.

 

[Cheese & Biscuits]

There's a surprise. I knew Nige would manage to stay as leader some way or another. I wouldn't be surprised if this was all pre-planned to save face.

 

[Womble98]

Nigel: Listen, I'm not the messiah!
UKIP: Only the true messiah would deny it.
Nigel: Listen just fuck off
UKIP: How shall we fuck off Oh Lord?

I'm told the phone call regarding his resignation went down something like this.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

David Milliband urging Labour to return to a more "aspiration focused" agenda. Careful obviously not to criticise Ed, but talking about the need for Labour to connect with business an be more forward thinking, whatever that means.

Seems to be a lot of calls for New Labour-esq reshaping. At least in the public sound bites we hear currently. I'm sure behind the scenes there must be intense debate between the left and central wings of the party. Going to be very interesting to see how it plays out in the leadership contest.

 

[TimeyWimey]

Damn, Dan Jarvis's post on why he's not running for leadership makes me wish he was running for leadership even more so.

Liz Kendall, I reckon. Though the Greg Davies factor is really, really distracting.

 

[Modernist]

So much for Farage being a man of his word then.

He's no different.

 

[Modernist]

Where were all the people now moaning about PR. You can't just dip your toe and then take it out whenever you wish, you need to stay engaged. People had their chance at PR and voted against it.

 

[TractorBoys]

David Milliband urging Labour to return to a more "aspiration focused" agenda. Careful obviously not to criticise Ed, but talking about the need for Labour to connect with business an be more forward thinking, whatever that means.

Seems to be a lot of calls for New Labour-esq reshaping. At least in the public sound bites we hear currently. I'm sure behind the scenes there must be intense debate between the left and central wings of the party. Going to be very interesting to see how it plays out in the leadership contest.

BBC have implied he's criticised him: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-32697212
I think that's bad journalism, he may have indirectly criticised Ed but the headline is a little strong.

 

[Red]

David Milliband urging Labour to return to a more "aspiration focused" agenda. Careful obviously not to criticise Ed, but talking about the need for Labour to connect with business an be more forward thinking, whatever that means.

Seems to be a lot of calls for New Labour-esq reshaping. At least in the public sound bites we hear currently. I'm sure behind the scenes there must be intense debate between the left and central wings of the party. Going to be very interesting to see how it plays out in the leadership contest.

It's a knee jerk reaction to Labour losing. I think Miliband moved the party to the left in a measured way. It's like others on here have said, they didn't refute the Tories claims about a lot of the issues robustly enough and also Miliband ultimately was not PM material in a lot of people's minds. With a stronger leader they will do better. I hope to God they don't revert back to New Labour. Tory-lite is not opposition.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

Yeah that seems inaccurate. Having heard the interview on which that article is based, the interviewer was desperate to get David to openly criticise Ed. David was well prepared and careful, going up to the line but not crossing it.

Was clear that David wasn't happy with how Ed had played it though. Although easy after the event and all that.

 

[Alty]

Where were all the people now moaning about PR. You can't just dip your toe and then take it out whenever you wish, you need to stay engaged. People had their chance at PR and voted against it.

People had their chance at PR? When?

 

[Freakyteeth]

Can't barrage the farage

 

[Gladders]

Good to see UKIP reject Farage's resignation, he is a big reason they managed to get 4m votes even if he didn't get elected himself. The party has got to be better off with him than without him.

 

[Techno Natch]

Good to see UKIP reject Farage's resignation, he is a big reason they managed to get 4m votes even if he didn't get elected himself. The party has got to be better off with him than without him.

I don't like them but he is the right man for the job. There would have been no referendum without Farage and their job is almost done.

 

[Red]

It makes sense for them to keep Farage on because their success is in many ways due to his charisma. I'm pretty sure that behind the scenes there will have been an agreement between the party and Farage that if he lost Thanet they'd not accept his resignation. He is a total and utter c***, of that there is no doubt, but like Techno says he is the right man for the job. If I supported UKIP I'd be happy that he's staying.

 

[TheArtfulDodger]

..

 

[TheArtfulDodger]

How do you explain places like Portsmouth, which have large working class areas, yet voted Tory in their numbers?

There are twats everywhere, obviously Portsmouth has a fair deal.

 

[Alty]

Good to see UKIP reject Farage's resignation, he is a big reason they managed to get 4m votes even if he didn't get elected himself. The party has got to be better off with him than without him.

Thing is, he could still have been a big figure in the party without being leader. This sort of reinforces the idea that they're a one man band.

Mind you, slim pickings for a replacement. Carswell would have been an option but doesn't want it. Wolfe and James are decent media performers but the latter doesn't want it either and I have no idea whether Wolfe would be interested.

 

[The Southbank]

There are twats everywhere, obviously Portsmouth has a fair deal.

Can't really argue with that, tbf.

 

[nousername]

I'm still in favour of a more proportional approach despite that result - obviously I expect people would have voted differently if it weren't FPTP. I'd personally like to see more coalition governments, it'd be nice if politicians felt they could work together more.

Really? With coalitions you don’t get the policies you voted for, as invariably all the parties involved have to compromise, water it down or worse. I'm not sure that's a good thing.

 

[mnb089mnb]

Really? With coalitions you don’t get the policies you voted for, as invariably all the parties involved have to compromise, water it down or worse. I'm not sure that's a good thing.

I'm getting none of the policies I voted for. Compromise is a good thing.

 

[mnb089mnb]

There are twats everywhere, obviously Portsmouth has a fair deal.

The last government created the role "Minister for Portsmouth".

 

[silkyman]

I'm getting none of the policies I voted for. Compromise is a good thing.

It seems the Tories are rushing to get some things that the lib dems held back - such as the 'snoopers charter' and stricter caps on benefits - pushed through ASAP now their shackles are off. That's evidence enough for me that a coalition can be a good thing.