National League Fixtures - 25/11/2017

[Look Out There Are Llamas]

We've definitely put a run together.

 

[Railway Blue]

Today I have witnessed the worst display from my team I’ve ever seen in my 23 years of supporting them, no doubt it, we were pathetic.

Awful tactically and awful in terms of effort, it was so bad the fans didn’t even boo at the end, Ross Embleton came over and aplogised to the fans and a few of the players did as well, but we were appalling.

Jake Caprices frustration turned to unprofessionalism as he decided to butcher the Torquay player after he lost the ball having no help from his team mates.

Unless the new manager, whoever he is can get us even remotely organised we will go down, I’ve never seen a team with such little direction and commitment. We kept getting caught countless times on the break and conceding chances.


It’s all down to our owners now, either pay the money for one of the better coaches or we are down, simple as that.

Torquay to their credit played well and that showing have half a chance of staying up.

I think one of the current bottom 4 will step up to make way for you boys. Unfortunately it won't be us ......... probably the Gulls on current form.

 

[Railway Blue]

After the way chester supporters behaved at the final whistle at our place i really hope its us or wrexham that send them down that bank of blacon rats running at us from behind the police cordon and making pretend injections in their arms whilst shouting smackheads will not be forgotten . Please, please , please let it be us so i can walk through chester in my tranmere top .

Never had you down as a saddo!

 

[Master D]

We’ve been bang average all season yet find ourselves 2pts off top. Aldershot have had a similar season by the sounds. If only we’d had last season’s team this season...

Still, 3 wins in a row for the first time all season so let’s see if we can keep this going for a bit. Someone has to put a run together and hopefully it’s us

The league is awful, I don't see anyone going on a run to match previous years down here. We can't score to save our lives and are equal top somehow. Nobody look like champions to me, apart from Tranmere, who'll still win this league.

 

[Sparrow]

Will this replace the now defunct 'Since Mellon Took Over' table?

It's now the Micky Mellon Crunch Talks Table.

 

[Look Out There Are Llamas]

I think one of the current bottom 4 will step up to make way for you boys. Unfortunately it won't be us ......... probably the Gulls on current form.

I think our saving grace is that George Elokobi should be back somepoint soon and that I think if in a few weeks time nothing changes Travis and Teague will throw money at not getting relegated. Another relegation would be a massive disaster. Being a division below Hampton & Richmond, Braintree or Chelmsford is absolutely not okay. Financially I imagine we'd take a massive hit as would the Leyton Orient brand, it's probably actually cheaper to throw another 250k at not getting relegated. If we do, according to Teague we have an estimated 2nd-5th budget, I wonder if that would be the largest budget to ever drop out of this league.

As it stands and without changes I would fancy Guiseley to end up above us. I'd expect someone else from that group as well as I expect a mid table team to do an Orient over the second half of the season and be drawn in, possibly Maidenhead.

We've released a little statement saying 14 games without a win is unexpected and unacceptable. No shit.

 

[Chief Rocka]

So what's Martin Ling's responsibility in all this? Didn't he appoint or at least have a hand in the last managerial disaster in Steve Davis, would you trust him to get it right this time?

Interesting the talk of budgets as it's all people on our board have been harping on about recently, we both should have a massive advantage over a majority of teams in this league with the parachute payments but both look like utter shite (one of us more than the other recently), feel as though if either of us don't go up this season or next we may be hanging around this hellhole league for a long time.

 

[GTFCfish]

One time, come on, let's win, one time is all I ask.

How did you get on Llamas........?

 

[Boz]

Hard to know the truth of the various rumours about Mellon or other’s responsibility for the pre-season squad issues. I tend towards the view that plans to move Cook on didn’t come about for whatever reason and the squad building was based on that false premise. While a decision will have to be taken about Cook in the New Year and personally I’d keep and let go on a free in the summer, at the moment things are looking hopeful.

Elsewhere, the cream is rising to the top, with Daggers and the Shots picking up, though the former disappointed on their recent visit to Birkenhead. Anyone could still win this league, even Tranmere. Though Boreham Wood were probably the best side I’ve seen so far this season.

At the bottom, would like Chester to stay up, for the local derby factor. Was surprised Astles didn’t make the starting xi yesterday as strikes me as one of their better players. Haven’t seen the other strugglers in action yet.

 

[Look Out There Are Llamas]

So Ling is Director of Football, he is basically CEO but for the footballing side and is responsible for acting as the bridge between that and the board, be it the senior team or the under 11s. The head coach will be directly answerable to Ling the same way the office staff are directly responsible to the CEO Danny Macklin - both of them then report directly to the chairman Nigel Travis. Ling made a few signings before Davis was appointed, but since then I believe that the head coach, director of football and chief scout will all have been involved in the transfers, which unlike most I'm not against - the more people approving a transfer deal mean less margin for error theoretically but boy did we fuck up over the summer in this regard. I was less confident than others at the time with two year deals and some of the signings but boy have they outperformed anything in my wildest nightmares, I still think player for player we have a better squad than those around us, but we don't have the right blend of players, it's all a collection of individuals, there's no synergy and they don't compliment each other. Others, like David Mooney and (controversial opinion alert) Matt Harrold have completely lost it. Ling was responsible for Davis appointment, however this time more people will be involved.

Budget wise I think we do both have an advantage and there is strong correlation with budget and team performance over a three year period, but of course that relies on signing players for their correct value to make the most of it, we've shown over the last four seasons or so it's not a guaranteed thing, as have Eastleigh. However I think that generally there's going to be a few teams with similar top end budgets and with only one automatic spot there's going to be a lot of disappointed teams. Additionally having six teams in the play offs dilutes a lot of things and adds a lot more random factors and less chance of promotion. We could both have strong seasons getting 80 points and finishing 4th - 5th. The added games completely ruin chances of promotion, as the more games in a single knockout format mean the more chance of losing obviously and to win over three play off tie rather than two is a lot harder.

Going forward, yeah, I'm confident that if we survive this season we'll be hitting the play offs quite regularly and I'd expect to see Hartlepool up there but again, with the extra two spots it's that much harder. Wrexham and Stockport are both massive clubs for non league, Wrexham are in year ten down here and the longest serving club at this level, Stockport, well, Stockport.... Luton, Cambridge and Oxford spent a while here, even with a large budget - and I expect us to have a top five budget for every season we're at this level - there's every chance we'll be stuck here especially as it seems more teams are throwing money into their playing staff.

This season looks to be one of the easiest to get out of as there's no stand out consistent team at the top yet, in future years we'll probably see league winners hitting 90+ again. Problem is, even if we go on a two point per game run I think the play offs are probably beyond us, for Hartlepool not so much, but then if you're hitting 4th-7th you've probably got a slightly worse than 6/1 shot of going up.

I also think relegation for you would be worse than us. A slight oxymoron, but I think the South is of better quality overall, but I think the North with Stockport, York, Kidderminster, maybe Hereford next year, Salford if they fuck up, Darlington, there's a log jam of bigger clubs at that level, not that I think for one minute Hartlepool will trouble relegation. With a lot of clubs around London (Braintree, Chelmsford, East Thurrock, Concord, Hampton, Dartford, Wealdstone, St Albans, Hemel, Welling) our relative purchase power would be insane and really only Billericay could get anywhere near that.

I can't believe I've just typed out a view on a realistic scenario e.g. us in the Conference South.

 

[The_Boss]

The Leyton Orient brand!!!!

 

[Look Out There Are Llamas]

We all have a brand, might be a shit one worth about 5p, but even so. There's a Macclesfield Town brand, there's an FC Halifax Town brand, there's even a blimming Solihull Moors brand. Ranging from products sold in the club shop, income from tickets, snacks etc. advertising reach, community work/ reach.

 

[Mark kavanagh]

Hard to know the truth of the various rumours about Mellon or other’s responsibility for the pre-season squad issues. I tend towards the view that plans to move Cook on didn’t come about for whatever reason and the squad building was based on that false premise. While a decision will have to be taken about Cook in the New Year and personally I’d keep and let go on a free in the summer, at the moment things are looking hopeful.

Elsewhere, the cream is rising to the top, with Daggers and the Shots picking up, though the former disappointed on their recent visit to Birkenhead. Anyone could still win this league, even Tranmere. Though Boreham Wood were probably the best side I’ve seen so far this season.

At the bottom, would like Chester to stay up, for the local derby factor. Was surprised Astles didn’t make the starting xi yesterday as strikes me as one of their better players. Haven’t seen the other strugglers in action yet.

Allegedly we made an offer for astles over the summer but chester offered him more money then we were prepared to go to

 

[Monkey Tennis]

Hard to know the truth of the various rumours about Mellon or other’s responsibility for the pre-season squad issues. I tend towards the view that plans to move Cook on didn’t come about for whatever reason and the squad building was based on that false premise. While a decision will have to be taken about Cook in the New Year and personally I’d keep and let go on a free in the summer, at the moment things are looking hopeful.

Elsewhere, the cream is rising to the top, with Daggers and the Shots picking up, though the former disappointed on their recent visit to Birkenhead. Anyone could still win this league, even Tranmere. Though Boreham Wood were probably the best side I’ve seen so far this season.

At the bottom, would like Chester to stay up, for the local derby factor. Was surprised Astles didn’t make the starting xi yesterday as strikes me as one of their better players. Haven’t seen the other strugglers in action yet.

You know that it is Cook that wants to leave, and that Tranmere aren't keen to sell? Wouldn't blame it on Mellon.

When he signed for Tranmere (over re-signing for us), it was because part of the deal was that his girlfriend also got a job at the club. Only she got herself sacked (for slagging off a director's wife or something), and that didn't go down too well in the Cook camp. So he's basically downed tools as much as is possible while still picking up a wage.

 

[Sparrow]

So Ling is Director of Football, he is basically CEO but for the footballing side and is responsible for acting as the bridge between that and the board, be it the senior team or the under 11s. The head coach will be directly answerable to Ling the same way the office staff are directly responsible to the CEO Danny Macklin - both of them then report directly to the chairman Nigel Travis. Ling made a few signings before Davis was appointed, but since then I believe that the head coach, director of football and chief scout will all have been involved in the transfers, which unlike most I'm not against - the more people approving a transfer deal mean less margin for error theoretically but boy did we fuck up over the summer in this regard. I was less confident than others at the time with two year deals and some of the signings but boy have they outperformed anything in my wildest nightmares, I still think player for player we have a better squad than those around us, but we don't have the right blend of players, it's all a collection of individuals, there's no synergy and they don't compliment each other. Others, like David Mooney and (controversial opinion alert) Matt Harrold have completely lost it. Ling was responsible for Davis appointment, however this time more people will be involved.

Budget wise I think we do both have an advantage and there is strong correlation with budget and team performance over a three year period, but of course that relies on signing players for their correct value to make the most of it, we've shown over the last four seasons or so it's not a guaranteed thing, as have Eastleigh. However I think that generally there's going to be a few teams with similar top end budgets and with only one automatic spot there's going to be a lot of disappointed teams. Additionally having six teams in the play offs dilutes a lot of things and adds a lot more random factors and less chance of promotion. We could both have strong seasons getting 80 points and finishing 4th - 5th. The added games completely ruin chances of promotion, as the more games in a single knockout format mean the more chance of losing obviously and to win over three play off tie rather than two is a lot harder.

Going forward, yeah, I'm confident that if we survive this season we'll be hitting the play offs quite regularly and I'd expect to see Hartlepool up there but again, with the extra two spots it's that much harder. Wrexham and Stockport are both massive clubs for non league, Wrexham are in year ten down here and the longest serving club at this level, Stockport, well, Stockport.... Luton, Cambridge and Oxford spent a while here, even with a large budget - and I expect us to have a top five budget for every season we're at this level - there's every chance we'll be stuck here especially as it seems more teams are throwing money into their playing staff.

This season looks to be one of the easiest to get out of as there's no stand out consistent team at the top yet, in future years we'll probably see league winners hitting 90+ again. Problem is, even if we go on a two point per game run I think the play offs are probably beyond us, for Hartlepool not so much, but then if you're hitting 4th-7th you've probably got a slightly worse than 6/1 shot of going up.

I also think relegation for you would be worse than us. A slight oxymoron, but I think the South is of better quality overall, but I think the North with Stockport, York, Kidderminster, maybe Hereford next year, Salford if they fuck up, Darlington, there's a log jam of bigger clubs at that level, not that I think for one minute Hartlepool will trouble relegation. With a lot of clubs around London (Braintree, Chelmsford, East Thurrock, Concord, Hampton, Dartford, Wealdstone, St Albans, Hemel, Welling) our relative purchase power would be insane and really only Billericay could get anywhere near that.

I can't believe I've just typed out a view on a realistic scenario e.g. us in the Conference South.

You forgot to mention that Ling is MIC’D UP in the stand giving all the instructions.

 

[B2TF]

We all have a brand, might be a shit one worth about 5p, but even so. There's a Macclesfield Town brand, there's an FC Halifax Town brand, there's even a blimming Solihull Moors brand. Ranging from products sold in the club shop, income from tickets, snacks etc. advertising reach, community work/ reach.

You'll never take our "failure" brand from us, we have it trademarked. Even today, if someone wants to humiliate another fan on Twitter, we are the go-to simile of choice. We're as proud of that as it is possible to be. Up The Shaymen.

 

[Luke Imp]

The Leyton Orient brand!!!!

How does it compare to the 'Eastleigh Vision', though?

 

[getoutofit]

You know that it is Cook that wants to leave, and that Tranmere aren't keen to sell? Wouldn't blame it on Mellon.

When he signed for Tranmere (over re-signing for us), it was because part of the deal was that his girlfriend also got a job at the club. Only she got herself sacked (for slagging off a director's wife or something), and that didn't go down too well in the Cook camp. So he's basically downed tools as much as is possible while still picking up a wage.

Cook is on 7 goals from about 15 starts this season, and in half of those he's been dragged off around the hour mark. This, on the back of the 23 he got last season, would suggest that even a half arsed (assuming what you say is true) andy cook is still our best striker by far. The likes of alabi and mcdonagh, who have been picked ahead of/replaced him during the season, are yet to get off the mark for us.

 

[Monkey Tennis]

Cook is on 7 goals from about 15 starts this season, and in half of those he's been dragged off around the hour mark. This, on the back of the 23 he got last season, would suggest that even a half arsed (assuming what you say is true) andy cook is still our best striker by far. The likes of alabi and mcdonagh, who have been picked ahead of/replaced him during the season, are on a grand total of 0 so far.

Credit to him for being a professional about it (completely out of character for him), but all I'm saying is that all the noises about leaving are coming from him.

 

[Soup Ladle]

For us, I bagsy the 'CURSED' brand.

 

[Master D]

Cook has been angling for a move since the summer and I think he'll go anywhere to escape his Tranmere HELL.

Someone on RP is saying we want him in January and if Tranmere still won't do business then we will be in for him again in the summer when he is on a free. I think he'll be 40 by the time we sign him. Nonetheless, there's strong rumours that we will be Going For It™ big-time in January, with a number of additions.

 

[getoutofit]

Today I have witnessed the worst display from my team I’ve ever seen in my 23 years of supporting them, no doubt it, we were pathetic.

Awful tactically and awful in terms of effort, it was so bad the fans didn’t even boo at the end, Ross Embleton came over and aplogised to the fans and a few of the players did as well, but we were appalling.

Jake Caprices frustration turned to unprofessionalism as he decided to butcher the Torquay player after he lost the ball having no help from his team mates.

Unless the new manager, whoever he is can get us even remotely organised we will go down, I’ve never seen a team with such little direction and commitment. We kept getting caught countless times on the break and conceding chances.

It’s all down to our owners now, either pay the money for one of the better coaches or we are down, simple as that.

Torquay to their credit played well and that showing have half a chance of staying up.

Your trajectory over the last 4 or 5 years has been eerily similar to ours. We topped league one in february 2013, you went one better and made the league one play offs the following season. And now look at us.

If i hadn't seen what happened to york last season, i'd be absolutely stunned by leyton orient's position at the moment, but i've learned to respect the teams in this league much more than i did when we first came down here. Some of them may play in what is essentially a field with a wall round it, but they're not fazed by big (relatively) names, and will make you battle for everything you get. It's quite annoying really.

 

[Boz]

You know that it is Cook that wants to leave, and that Tranmere aren't keen to sell? Wouldn't blame it on Mellon.

When he signed for Tranmere (over re-signing for us), it was because part of the deal was that his girlfriend also got a job at the club. Only she got herself sacked (for slagging off a director's wife or something), and that didn't go down too well in the Cook camp. So he's basically downed tools as much as is possible while still picking up a wage.

Have you got a time for when this alleged sacking of his girlfriend took place? Interesting and not an account I'd heard before

Mellon seemed to prefer Stockton on the basis of work-rate stats, which put Cook's nose out of joint, understandably, given how good his finishing had been for us.

It was rumoured that a deal had been lined up for a move to a L2 club, but it was Cook who pulled out because the terms didn't meet his requirements. Mellon's summer recruitment was based using the Cook funds which didn't materialise and possibly less money due to the pop concert loss, hence the ill-balanced squad. How true this is, I have no idea, but as getoutofit correctly asserts even a sulky Cook is still the best striker in the squad.

 

[RLC]

Because of the constant messing round with the front players, it is only in the last couple of weeks that Cook and Norwood have looked like the strike pairing of last season. Regardless of the politics of the summer, once we knew Cook was staying we should have made him central to our plans, not played nonentities in his place. Mellon started Alabi ahead of Cook at Torquay on the opening day and things unravelled from there.

 

[Sparrow]

Cook has been angling for a move since the summer and I think he'll go anywhere to escape his Tranmere HELL.

Someone on RP is saying we want him in January and if Tranmere still won't do business then we will be in for him again in the summer when he is on a free. I think he'll be 40 by the time we sign him. Nonetheless, there's strong rumours that we will be Going For It™ big-time in January, with a number of additions.

Cook doesn’t want to risk his life any longer in the Prenton Park DEATH TRAP.

 

[The Terminator]

Your trajectory over the last 4 or 5 years has been eerily similar to ours. We topped league one in february 2013, you went one better and made the league one play offs the following season. And now look at us.

If i hadn't seen what happened to york last season, i'd be absolutely stunned by leyton orient's position at the moment, but i've learned to respect the teams in this league much more than i did when we first came down here. Some of them may play in what is essentially a field with a wall round it, but they're not fazed by big (relatively) names, and will make you battle for everything you get. It's quite annoying really.

You are right in everything you say, I was expecting this league to be what it is having watched it down the years, so to me its not s suprise, you have to earn the right to get out of it.

However from our perspective and I don't like bringing this up, I still blame our old owners for this mess, he deliberately sold us as late as he could in the summer, we had no coaching staff and no first team, meaning we had only 5 weeks to bring in a manager and as many players as we could.

I understand why we chose Steve Davis, but he turned out to be a disaster because he didn't respect this league and refused to adapt to it like you mentioned, our cartake manager Ross Embleton is the same as well, thinking you can play total football all the time thinking it will work, well, it doesn't as teams will punish you.

We now have to get someone in with experience in this league and if that means paying them over the odds, then they need to do it because otherwise we will go down. However we've never been a club willing to pay other clubs compensation for managers.

We are 14 games without a win, its the clubs worst run of form for 55 years.

 

[Raymondo316]

If we do, according to Teague we have an estimated 2nd-5th budget, I wonder if that would be the largest budget to ever drop out of this league.

York managed to do it last year with a top 3 budget.

 

[Monkey Tennis]

Have you got a time for when this alleged sacking of his girlfriend took place? Interesting and not an account I'd heard before

Mellon seemed to prefer Stockton on the basis of work-rate stats, which put Cook's nose out of joint, understandably, given how good his finishing had been for us.

It was rumoured that a deal had been lined up for a move to a L2 club, but it was Cook who pulled out because the terms didn't meet his requirements. Mellon's summer recruitment was based using the Cook funds which didn't materialise and possibly less money due to the pop concert loss, hence the ill-balanced squad. How true this is, I have no idea, but as getoutofit correctly asserts even a sulky Cook is still the best striker in the squad.

No idea when it happened - presumably around the time he started angling for a move! I've heard it from someone who works at Tranmere, and I'm sure anyone there can back it up. Whenever it happened, you'll have seen his work-rate drop.
When he left us, it was for a L2 club that 'didn't meet his requirements'. It seems like that's a line his agent likes spinning. It used to be his dad, because he couldn't trust his son to make wise decisions, but I think he's got involved with someone desperate to make as much money off his client as possible.

 

[SkyBluesRose]

York managed to do it last year with a top 3 budget.

They also had Jackie McNamara who shouldn't be anywhere near managing.

 

[B2TF]

How does it compare to the 'Eastleigh Vision', though?

On Saturday's evidence, the Vision is fading fast. Is Wallet Man running out of money now?