THL Expansion

[BeesKnees]

Club have have shared next stage of the development of the Hive

New South stand same as north with rear extensions to North, South and West. East Stand to become terracing. Capacity increased to 8,000.
New indoor sports academy for Cat 1 academy. New sports hall.

Later plans to fill in corners so expect final stadium to be around 10,000 capacity.

 

[barnet_pls]

What did Rossi etc have to say about hopes for the actual football?

 

[BeesKnees]

What did Rossi etc have to say about hopes for the actual football?

Round and bouncy

 

[Kenneth E End]

Doesn't it cost £2m a year to run a Cat 1 academy? Surely that money could be better spent elsewhere?

 

[BeesKnees]

Doesn't it cost £2m a year to run a Cat 1 academy? Surely that money could be better spent elsewhere?

Maybe, depends what you are aiming for. My guess is priority is to have the facilities sufficient for Cat 1\2, provide for clubs playing at Wembley and bring in more non-matchday revenue with the sports hall etc.

 

[Kenneth E End]

Maybe, depends what you are aiming for. My guess is priority is to have the facilities sufficient for Cat 1\2, provide for clubs playing at Wembley and bring in more non-matchday revenue with the sports hall etc.

Well hire money for a sports hall will make all the difference!

At the end of the day, if a player is good enough to attend a Cat 1 academy, they're not going to choose Barnet ahead of the likes of Chelsea, Arsenal, Tottenham et al in the not too insignificant distance.

 

[Luke Imp]

Is there any point in the capacity of The Hive increasing?

 

[BeesKnees]

Is there any point in the capacity of The Hive increasing?

The Chairman committed to building a 10k stadium when he bought the club over 20 years ago. Can't say he isn't determined.
Whether there is a point depends on what happens next. Promotion or consistently top half league 2 then probably. Lower league 2\ relegation then no.

 

[BeesKnees]

Well hire money for a sports hall will make all the difference!

At the end of the day, if a player is good enough to attend a Cat 1 academy, they're not going to choose Barnet ahead of the likes of Chelsea, Arsenal, Tottenham et al in the not too insignificant distance.

Your sniping is pretty pathetic and fails to understand how profitable all the activities at the Hive are when viewed as a whole.

Since when were kids fully developed players and what is to say those kids at a better facility wont develop into better players because of it. It's not really a case of competing to gain players and more ensuring we realise money from the ones we already have and continue to improve the first team. A significant number of our current academy get poached by premiership clubs who pay £50,000 compensation for a 16 year old in our current academy, with a higher level academy they have to pay £160,000 to steal the same youngster. Our chairman is desperate to move to a model of developing all our own players if he can and is willing to pay for it, whether and when that means we reach Cat 1 is anyones guess but the aim is to have the facilities so we can.

 

[Kenneth E End]

Your sniping is pretty pathetic and fails to understand how profitable all the activities at the Hive are when viewed as a whole.

Since when were kids fully developed players and what is to say those kids at a better facility wont develop into better players because of it. It's not really a case of competing to gain players and more ensuring we realise money from the ones we already have and continue to improve the first team. A significant number of our current academy get poached by premiership clubs who pay £50,000 compensation for a 16 year old in our current academy, with a higher level academy they have to pay £160,000 to steal the same youngster. Our chairman is desperate to move to a model of developing all our own players if he can and is willing to pay for it, whether and when that means we reach Cat 1 is anyones guess but the aim is to have the facilities so we can.

Not sniping at all, just a realist. I think as a stadium complex, The Hive is genuinely one of the most impressive in the country. The new away end is probably, comfort wise, the best in the division bar none. I realise the medical part of the complex is very profitable.

But increasing the capacity of the ground when you're already outside the club's traditional heartland and where supporters, despite being in a relatively highly populated area, haven't embraced it beyond a couple of thousand on average, probably wouldn't provide value for money.

Nor would the considerable expense of growing the academy to that status. Would Barnet see the cost benefit?

 

[AdamStag]

Your sniping is pretty pathetic and fails to understand how profitable all the activities at the Hive are when viewed as a whole.

Since when were kids fully developed players and what is to say those kids at a better facility wont develop into better players because of it. It's not really a case of competing to gain players and more ensuring we realise money from the ones we already have and continue to improve the first team. A significant number of our current academy get poached by premiership clubs who pay £50,000 compensation for a 16 year old in our current academy, with a higher level academy they have to pay £160,000 to steal the same youngster. Our chairman is desperate to move to a model of developing all our own players if he can and is willing to pay for it, whether and when that means we reach Cat 1 is anyones guess but the aim is to have the facilities so we can.

It makes perfect sense for clubs at our level to be bringing in young players which can be potentially sold on and/or help provide a good season on the pitch.

Bearing in mind Keeny keeps quoting ridiculous and unrealistic fees for potential sale of Luton players, and their youth success in that crap cup last season, i'd have thought he'd have been more accepting of an innovative approach.

 

[Kenneth E End]

It makes perfect sense for clubs at our level to be bringing in young players which can be potentially sold on and/or help provide a good season on the pitch.

Bearing in mind Keeny keeps quoting ridiculous and unrealistic fees for potential sale of Luton players, and their youth success in that crap cup last season, i'd have thought he'd have been more accepting of an innovative approach.

I didn't say that wasn't the case. And I know you're on the wind up too.

It was costing us around £400,000 a year in non league to maintain our Cat III academy. That is a lot of money for a club our side, let alone Barnet, although I understand they have other ancillary income.

In terms of unrealistic fees, I see Liverpool have just spent nearly £40m on a player that completely failed in the PL a few years ago. Transfer fees have gone through the roof in the last few seasons. Its a sellers market, but we have no need to sell unless for the right price.

 

[BeesKnees]

Now on clubs website
https://www.barnetfc.com/news/2017/june/stadium-and-academy-plans/

 

[Kenneth E End]

Same architects who are designing our new stadium.

 

[BeesKnees]

Not sniping at all, just a realist. I think as a stadium complex, The Hive is genuinely one of the most impressive in the country. The new away end is probably, comfort wise, the best in the division bar none. I realise the medical part of the complex is very profitable.

But increasing the capacity of the ground when you're already outside the club's traditional heartland and where supporters, despite being in a relatively highly populated area, haven't embraced it beyond a couple of thousand on average, probably wouldn't provide value for money.

Nor would the considerable expense of growing the academy to that status. Would Barnet see the cost benefit?

The club is most definitely looking forward rather than assuming it will stand still and the Hive is yet to have a big cup tie or be involved in league 2 play off matches. This is the money from the sale of Underhill being used to develop the Hive so it's definitely not a waste.

The capacity issue was always going to happen and isn't a bad thing imo. Sooner or later the 5176 restriction on a 6350 capacity stadium was going to be addressed and may as well get all the development work done at the same time. There is also currently a problem with the East Stand, the club have been instructed by the league to move all Hospitality, Directors and press to the West stand due to the lack of cover and poor view. Without those people present and a lack of interest in uncovered seats the best option is to take out the 750 seats which creates a terrace with a capacity of 1500-1600 (Effectively pushing the capacity over 7000). The South terrace has been given away and a new stand will close in the ground so it has a better atmosphere. So by making the changes the capacity moves up to 8,000 which isn't exactly massive and should help attract a few more international friendlies and womens cup finals in addition to hopefully some improvement in the clubs position.

I think our academy is already operating beyond Cat 3 and it is the lack of indoor training facilities that prevent it getting a higher level. Even without rising to those categories the facilities will still be a benefit to the club. One thing is sure of our chairman, if he can't make money from it then he wont do it.

 

[AdamStag]

I'm pleased that you've done this, but how would raising the capacity to 8,000 attract an international?

 

[BeesKnees]

I'm pleased that you've done this, but how would raising the capacity to 8,000 attract an international?

We've had a few already.
The chairman is constantly on the lookout for more games and the more attractive the facilities the easier he can sell it. So far it's been England U20s , Nigeria v Senegal.

I know Wycombe and probably other clubs with similar 8-10k stadiums are constantly competing for this kind of second tier international. Some of which can get crowds of 6-7000.

 

[CFC91]

We've had England at under 17s, 19s, 21s and Womens at ours and it is quite a money spinner. Our selling point are the facilities and proximity to St Georges Park.

 

[mowgli]

We've had England at under 17s, 19s, 21s and Womens at ours and it is quite a money spinner. Our selling point are the facilities and proximity to St Georges Park.

We have the same teams and as you say it's worth it financially,plus we have Reading under 21's.

 

[TommoCUFC]

Doesn't it cost £2m a year to run a Cat 1 academy? Surely that money could be better spent elsewhere?

Don't forget that Barnet will be getting a £78m windfall when John Akinde moves to whichever championship club he's most recently been linked with

 

[BeesKnees]

Don't forget that Barnet will be getting a £78m windfall when John Akinde moves to whichever championship club he's most recently been linked with

We'd reject it.

 

[Maple Hatter]

I'm all for modernising stadia so good luck to Barnet on that front. Just a shame that they had to move away from their historical home to do it. 10k does seem a little high for a club that only attracted 1.6k home fans last season and has traditionally always had a low supporter base. A top half postion in league two or even promotion to league one will hardly result in a substantial increase in gates, certainly nowhere near the capacity your chairman is aiming at.

 

[BeesKnees]

I'm all for modernising stadia so good luck to Barnet on that front. Just a shame that they had to move away from their historical home to do it. 10k does seem a little high for a club that only attracted 1.6k home fans last season and has traditionally always had a low supporter base. A top half postion in league two or even promotion to league one will hardly result in a substantial increase in gates, certainly nowhere near the capacity your chairman is aiming at.

I agree it would need a significant increase to make further changes beyond the 8000.

If we upped our average attendance from 2300 to 3000 and had the occasional 5000-7000 game I would be more than happy.

The current situation of having a stadium with a capacity of 6300 that's restricted to 5176 is no good and we've already had games that went over the restriction.

 

[northstandexile]

Why is it restricted down to 5176 from 6300?

 

[BeesKnees]

Why is it restricted down to 5176 from 6300?

The original application in 2008 before we made the decision to move there was for that number. Due to the short notice it was easier to get through planning permission by using the previous reports.

Now the dust has settled the club can get this resolved. It will probably be quite costly with the council asking for money to improve local transport and roads leading up to the ground.

 

[Kenneth E End]

The original application in 2008 before we made the decision to move there was for that number. Due to the short notice it was easier to get through planning permission by using the previous reports.

Now the dust has settled the club can get this resolved. It will probably be quite costly with the council asking for money to improve local transport and roads leading up to the ground.

But in the longer run it has proven more costly...?

 

[BeesKnees]

But in the longer run it has proven more costly...?

I'm not sure what you are asking.

 

[BeesKnees]

It's recently been revealed that the chairman has bought the freehold.
Means lease restrictions will no longer apply.

 

[George Reilly's Hairpiece]

Which has Harrow Conservative MP Bob Blackman on the warpath. The only time you'd want him anywhere near you is when you are trying to convince a partner that your 4 inches is 8 inches long. #BobExaggerates#MileageExpensesAreSubjective

 

[George Reilly's Hairpiece]

The best part of this is that Blackman is a Spurs fan, so you have to admire at some level his decrying of Barnet ruining the local community, whist ignoring the literal bulldozer that was driven through local businesses to facilitate the New White Hart Lane.