Which sides do you want to see come up from the Connie?

[Son of Cod]

I thought about leaving Mansfield out, to be fair, because I think them and Lincoln are really traditional fourth tier clubs while all of the rest have spent time as high as the top of the third tier or second tier relatively recently. I think Lincoln had basically become a non-league club to be honest in terms of pretty much everything until circumstances all just clicked at the right time.

Our ownership is incomparable to the 20 years of chaos that you’ll remember from us in the league. We’re owned by a pair of Danish brothers who work in football analytics (similar company to the guy who owns Brentford) who are quiet, unassuming and make no wild statements or promises. I mean, we’ve still got the same manager as we had the year we went down, which is miracle stuff for Notts.

It's a good point about Lincoln essentially becoming a non-league club, which makes their upturn even more impressive really I guess.

Just had a look into your owners/Football Radar. Bit of a weird site, football analysts for betting but they don't appear to have any products on offer. Any idea what sort of clients they have?

 

[jacobncfc]

It's a good point about Lincoln essentially becoming a non-league club, which makes their upturn even more impressive really I guess.

Just had a look into your owners/Football Radar. Bit of a weird site, football analysts for betting but they don't appear to have any products on offer. Any idea what sort of clients they have

Nope, much like their approach to running Notts, it’s all very quiet and under the radar. No one even really has any idea how much they’re worth - at the time they took over people worked out that the family has also got all sorts of business/investment interests in Denmark, but that’s about all we know. Seems pretty certain that it isn’t Football Radar that is providing the funding.

It’ll be interesting to see what their plans are in the more medium term. They seem to have one of their top analysis people from Football Radar working as a kind of technical director, but have also been very clear that Ardley currently has the final say on things and they seem pretty content to let him get on with for the time being.

We’ve signed a couple of players recommended by their player analysis people, and every signing gets checked out by them first as well, but that along with the data on every match and opposition that Ardley is always talking about seems to be the extent of what they’re getting involved in so far.

 

[Luke Imp]

Yep, I always think you've got 3 years or so before you become part of the league you're in. We basically decided to turn ourselves into an NL Club about 5 months into our first season down there because we decided to cut our budget by 50% in the January transfer window (in the days when there were transfer windows) and made no real effort to get promoted in either of the two parachute payment seasons, albeit forced to do so rather than wanting to.

 

[Luke Imp]

A variety of reasons but if you're at extreme ends of the country you might be more in favour. I think we'd get bigger crowds. We average 3500 down here and that's with some of the smallest away followings, that figure would definitely get boosted. I'd be able to get to more away games, easier to get around etc and overall operating costs would be lower.

I'm not too sure travelling is that small a cost for a NL side. Our recent P-P at Dagenham apparently cost the club 5k in travel and overnight stay. You could argue London doesn't need to be an overnight stay of course but there are about 6 northern/midlands clubs in the NL and it costs money treking around and we do need overnighters sometimes. It's not insignificant for us. We have the most miles to cover out of any team this year so I'm open to regionalisation tbh.

Yeah, it's been something discussed in the EFL time and time again but most Chairman don't actually see that much benefit from it.

Regionals would create a bigger gap to the next league is one of the arguments, EFL/PL payments would decline so any local games would only (possibly part) make that shortfall up and one of the draws of local games is the novelty of it rather than having one most weeks.

I'd be against is personally, as are our Board, not that I think it'll ever be considered in the near future. Travelling for us is a low cost in terms of our overall costs but we're better located for that than you, albeit still out on a limb a bit.

 

[shoddycollins]

Can you let the resident village idiot from Halifax know that they weren't mentioned on the list please?
Left out in the cold by fellow Brothers.
Maybe something to do with being a tin pot phoenix club.

What are you doing here? Thought you only posted in the NL forum.

 

[Back in the DHSS]

Borehamwood is a tidy set up and decent ground. Pity they’ve got no fans. Just 1500 of them turned up at Wembley for our play off final, in which our player Josh Ginelly got bottled in front of the camera’s. The female culprit was never prosecuted.

 

[AdamStag]

Yep, I always think you've got 3 years or so before you become part of the league you're in. We basically decided to turn ourselves into an NL Club about 5 months into our first season down there because we decided to cut our budget by 50% in the January transfer window (in the days when there were transfer windows) and made no real effort to get promoted in either of the two parachute payment seasons, albeit forced to do so rather than wanting to.

I think with the conference, you only get out of it once you admit you’re non league, which for us was probably halfway through the 2nd season. Also seeing rivals telling you you’re non league when they were still in the league was painful (though karma is a most wonderful thing)

you’d have had clubs who thought they were too good to be down there, and i can imagine a large portion of notts fans thinking that too as they were once good or something or other irrelevant to now (not jacob who’s been in this thread, who seems remarkably realistic for a county fan) Once you get the chip off your shoulder it becomes easier and you’ve an idea on how to get back out again.

Either way, it’s a process i don’t want to experience again.

 

[jacobncfc]

It probably had something to do with the farcical circumstances in which we came down and started last season, but I’ve been surprised by how we’ve not done that. The whole club from ownership down to fans has been really realistic about it, which is a large part of why we’ve pretty much had promotion chasing form from the off.

Although, as I’ve said a few times, it’s changed massively as a league since Stags were down here. The percentage of completely full time clubs with aspirations of league football in the near future is much higher, which makes it less of a culture shock.

 

[Reremnart]

Like to see Wrexham back in the League as it is a top away day Stockport wouldn`t be too bad either . We could give them their goalposts back from our last visit. However seeing Notlob (the backwards Mancs) in the Conference would be better or maybe Forest Gump back there were they truly belong.

 

[Reremnart]

Yeah, they've done their time and some. I still want the whole Ryan Reynolds thing to turn sour somehow

As somebody on one of our fan sites described it "Deadpool buys Cesspool" which is a bit unfair as we all know the real cesspool lies just off Junction 6 of the M61

 

[AdamStag]

It probably had something to do with the farcical circumstances in which we came down and started last season, but I’ve been surprised by how we’ve not done that. The whole club from ownership down to fans has been really realistic about it, which is a large part of why we’ve pretty much had promotion chasing form from the off.

Although, as I’ve said a few times, it’s changed massively as a league since Stags were down here. The percentage of completely full time clubs with aspirations of league football in the near future is much higher, which makes it less of a culture shock.

It was certainly different, as you’d have half the league who did well and half the league who were hopelessly tinpot and would come for the draw with their play acting and the like, it wasn’t a good view.

I think there were 3 seasons (our 3rd 4th and last) where the conference was at its hardest to get out of and we were very fortunate to do it.

our playoff season (4th) wrexham finished on 99 points and didn’t go up, we finished on 89 and finished about 20/25 points off top spot, the season we won it we won a record equalling 12 games on the bounce and 21 out of the last 25 and still only won it on the last day, what was needed was unreal), from afar it looks considerably easier now than when we were in it.

however, someone not in the conference would look at the league now and see the likes of sutton, eastleigh and especially altrincham knocking around and say the league looks easy quality wise, but obviously it’s hard to gauge and compare - in reality there probably isn’t masses of difference - apart from the playoff system has changed

 

[jacobncfc]

It’s very hard to compare. Fylde got relegated last season on a budget that wouldn’t have looked at out of place in League Two.

My hunch would be that the strongest teams back then were probably a bit stronger than they are now, but the teams in the bottom half are significantly stronger now than they were. I think the days of multiple teams in a season getting 85+ points are over because there are just more teams capable of taking points off you. I’m not sure if that makes it easier or not.

Just on those three examples, they would seem like that from the outside, but Eastleigh and Sutton are both pretty well funded and established full-time teams now who wouldn’t really be out of place in League Two. Altrincham are, as far as I know, heading in that way too.

 

[Chris FGR]

What's going to happen at the bottom of the NL now there is no relegation. Will teams that don't want to play on be allowed to stop and have their records expunged, but be allowed to start again next year, and will some others furlough players and put scratch teams out every week to save money? Seems a bit of a mess.

 

[AdamStag]

What's going to happen at the bottom of the NL now there is no relegation. Will teams that don't want to play on be allowed to stop and have their records expunged, but be allowed to start again next year, and will some others furlough players and put scratch teams out every week to save money? Seems a bit of a mess.

Surely you can just furlough all your staff, play kids and know you’re not going down.

Whereas i’ve not taken much note of late, the conference board were hopelessly inept and i dare say that’s probably not changed, so they’ve probably made up some rule about not doing that!

 

[JaredSUFC]

It’s very hard to compare. Fylde got relegated last season on a budget that wouldn’t have looked at out of place in League Two.

My hunch would be that the strongest teams back then were probably a bit stronger than they are now, but the teams in the bottom half are significantly stronger now than they were. I think the days of multiple teams in a season getting 85+ points are over because there are just more teams capable of taking points off you. I’m not sure if that makes it easier or not.

Just on those three examples, they would seem like that from the outside, but Eastleigh and Sutton are both pretty well funded and established full-time teams now who wouldn’t really be out of place in League Two. Altrincham are, as far as I know, heading in that way too.

We’re not particularly well funded, neither are we full-time. We’re still run by volunteers with a tight budget for the first team. We have grown as a club however we’re a different world from a lot of clubs at our level. If (and it’s a big if) we were to go up we may have some issues adapting off the field, as it is a big step up, however that was also the case when we were promoted to the National League.

This is an interesting interview with our manager Matt Gray (shame it’s from the Daily M**l) Sutton United tells Matt Gray he wants to go to Wembley with the club

 

[jacobncfc]

Are you one of the hybrid ones that are kind of full time for the first team? I’d kind of assumed you’d made that step as, from the outside, you’ve put together a very useful squad for NL level.

 

[Robshep]

We’re not particularly well funded, neither are we full-time. We’re still run by volunteers with a tight budget for the first team. We have grown as a club however we’re a different world from a lot of clubs at our level. If (and it’s a big if) we were to go up we may have some issues adapting off the field, as it is a big step up, however that was also the case when we were promoted to the National League.

This is an interesting interview with our manager Matt Gray (shame it’s from the Daily M**l) Sutton United tells Matt Gray he wants to go to Wembley with the club

It would be good to see a southern based club get promoted that has done it through sheer hard work and not funded from outside. You are one of the few who exist at that level who have a chance. Even Stockport are bankrolled.

 

[Hooped Wizard]

There’s still loads of money bags clubs about, particularly in the NL south. Mind you, Fylde are one of them as well and actually managed to get relegated last season, so it’s becoming a harder league for them as well.

The one thing that the NL does seem to be able to do is allow the historic/traditional league clubs who’ve become basket cases to get their shit together, bottom out and come back stronger. Would say that applies to Oxford, Luton, Bristol Rovers, Tranmere, Mansfield and Leyton Orient. Notts and Chesterfield are probably going to do similar over the next couple of years.

In fact, are Grimsby the only one of what you’d say are well-supported, historic ex-league clubs to fall out of the league, come back and not really kick on anywhere afterwards?

Could also include ourselves in that, only took 5 years to get to the championship and then stayed there for 5 glorious seasons.


Hope for you all.

 

[JaredSUFC]

Are you one of the hybrid ones that are kind of full time for the first team? I’d kind of assumed you’d made that step as, from the outside, you’ve put together a very useful squad for NL level.

In the article above Matt Gray says we’re three quarter full-time. We do train during the day, but ‘only’ 3 days a week, which we’ve been doing since we were in the Conference South. In terms of playing staff the squad is a mix of young talent signed from feeder league clubs (Ajiboye, Wyatt), players who’ve been at this level a while (Bugiel, Randall), returning players who’ve not had the success at higher level one would have hoped for (Beautyman, John), loan players (Olafe) and random signings who are just happen to be in the area (Bouzanis whose partner is at Arsenal Women, Barden who was playing in the US before coming home to the London area).

We also never stay anywhere overnight if we can help it, for cost reasons we travel to away games on the day of a match.

 

[Robshep]

Could also include ourselves in that, only took 5 years to get to the championship and then stayed there for 5 glorious seasons.


Hope for you all.

Read about the period that led to you ending up in non league. Your greatest achievement was surviving that. Its quite a story.

 

[Atavistic]

As someone well divorced with the realities of football at this level, my view is that I always like to see a mix of teams come up from the National League into League 2; that usually means one established former Football League and one of the more traditional non-league sides who either haven't reached the Football League before or haven't spent very long there before. I remember that year when it was Tranmere vs Boreham Wood in the play-off final thinking that I'd like to see Boreham Wood go up, out of sheer morbid curiosity about how a team with that small a fanbase would manage in the Football League.

Just looking at those teams currently in the top half (and likely in with a realistic shot of promotion), I'd like to see Torquay return after their recent struggles (including that one season in the National League South) and I'd be pleased to see Sutton or maybe Bromley join them. Don't think Notts County have been down there long enough just yet to want them back, and I definitely don't want Wrexham back yet now that they're going to be bankrolled like anything (and that's not because I hate the bankrolled teams, but because I hate the hypocrisy people express in being happy that Wrexham are bankrolled but raging that the upstarts like Solihull Moors have the audacity to have a bit of money to give it a go).

Wouldn't be against seeing Hartlepool or Stockport return, while Maidenhead and Eastleigh fall into that "morbid curiosity" category that Boreham Wood once did (definitely don't want them up now, though).

 

[Robshep]

In the article above Matt Gray says we’re three quarter full-time. We do train during the day, but ‘only’ 3 days a week, which we’ve been doing since we were in the Conference South. In terms of playing staff the squad is a mix of young talent signed from feeder league clubs (Ajiboye, Wyatt), players who’ve been at this level a while (Bugiel, Randall), returning players who’ve not had the success at higher level one would have hoped for (Beautyman, John), loan players (Olafe) and random signings who are just happen to be in the area (Bouzanis whose partner is at Arsenal Women, Barden who was playing in the US before coming home to the London area).

We also never stay anywhere overnight if we can help it, for cost reasons we travel to away games on the day of a match.

The time in the National League was unwanted but enjoyable. We rebuilt ourselves both as a club and a fanbase, the way to approach that league from what we learned is accept it and not think it is beneath you because you are there because you were not good enough to be in League 2. The strangest thing to come out of it was the friendship with South Park FC. I doubt you could get two more places as far apart in profile as Birkenhead and Reigate but we have adopted them as our southern based non league club of choice. Strange bedfellows.

 

[Vanni]

First off, I've got nothing against the NL sides currently in with a chance of winning promotion, in fact as you probably all know by now, I've been an advocate of 3 up 3 down for years. But thing is I'm not that sure there'll be relegation from L2 this season.

Grimsby, Barrow and Southend will almost certainly be supported by the other 21 clubs because all the other clubs know that it could very well be them in the near future and right now that's a cause for concern. For starters, you could have 7 NL clubs this season ending up fulfilling their fixtures with teams full of kids. It is bad enough when one team does it let alone seven.

I wouldn't be surprised if the EFL allows the two promoted teams to come up but scraps relegation for a year or two. 26 sides rather than the 24 for a season or two until matters are sorted out in the NL makes a lot of sense to me. Sending down two L2 sides into a league that is seemingly falling apart at the moment would be most unfair on the two sides.

 

[Robshep]

First off, I've got nothing against the NL sides currently in with a chance of winning promotion, in fact as you probably all know by now, I've been an advocate of 3 up 3 down for years. But thing is I'm not that sure there'll be relegation from L2 this season.

Grimsby, Barrow and Southend will almost certainly be supported by the other 21 clubs because all the other clubs L2 clubs know that it could very well be them in the near future and right now that's a cause for concern. For starters, you could have 7 NL clubs this season ending up fulfilling their fixtures with teams full of kids. It is bad enough when one team does it let alone seven.

I wouldn't be surprised if the EFL allows the two promoted teams to come up but scraps relegation for a year or two. 26 sides rather than the 24 for a season or two until matters are sorted out in the NL makes a lot of sense to me. Sending down two L2 sides into a league that is seemingly falling apart at the moment would be most unfair on the two sides.

A fair idea but unfortunately it relies on the EFL showing some common sense. A fairer solution would to expel any club from the National League who decides to play with understrength teams and play on with whatever clubs are left. They can sort the mess out in the summer.

 

[Vanni]

''and I definitely don't want Wrexham back yet now that they're going to be bankrolled like anything (and that's not because I hate the bankrolled teams, but because I hate the hypocrisy people express in being happy that Wrexham are bankrolled but raging that the upstarts like Solihull Moors have the audacity to have a bit of money to give it a go)''

This ^

Well said Atavistic. Bravo.

Further more, people seem to disregard the fact that clubs such as Wrexham are well supported. It has always been my opinion that a club that can get 4000-5000 for home matches (pre covid times of course) should win promotion to the FL without resorting to outside help. If they're unable to then in my book that would only mean they're not a well run club.

The Wrexham fans are taking exception to them being called the New Salford. Personally I think they're even worse. The two Hollywood celebs do not have any links at all with the club and they have also admitted they were looking at a few other clubs (apparently one of those clubs was Hartlepool) before the takeover.

The fact they had never showed the slightest bit of interest in the club before buying it is the very definition of a hobby club IMO.

 

[Grumpy Grecian]

There is still a distinct possibility (covid permitting) that SUFC could be replacing SUFC at the season's end.

 

[Robshep]

''and I definitely don't want Wrexham back yet now that they're going to be bankrolled like anything (and that's not because I hate the bankrolled teams, but because I hate the hypocrisy people express in being happy that Wrexham are bankrolled but raging that the upstarts like Solihull Moors have the audacity to have a bit of money to give it a go)''

This ^

Well said Atavistic. Bravo.

Further more, people seem to disregard the fact that clubs such as Wrexham are well supported. It has always been my opinion that a club that can get 4000-5000 for home matches (pre covid times of course) should win promotion to the FL without resorting to outside help. If they're unable to then in my book that would only mean they're not a well run club.

The Wrexham fans are taking exception to them being called the New Salford. Personally I think they're even worse. The two Hollywood celebs do not have any links at all with the club and they have also admitted they were looking at a few other clubs (apparently one of those clubs was Hartlepool) before the takeover.

The fact they had never showed the slightest bit of interest in the club before buying it is the very definition of a hobby club IMO.

There is no love lost between us and Wrexham. The only slight link is that one of the two owners had an ancestor who was once a coalminer in North Wales. Definite hobby club.

 

[Monkey Tennis]

A fair idea but unfortunately it relies on the EFL showing some common sense. A fairer solution would to expel any club from the National League who decides to play with understrength teams and play on with whatever clubs are left. They can sort the mess out in the summer.

I'm not sure it's fair to expel teams that can't afford to play on because they weren't given the funding they were told to expect. The National League need to help those clubs secure grants to complete the season with full strength teams. Not Dover though - they've no interest in the integrity of the competition.

We won't see 26 teams in League 2 - that's not feasible.

Obviously if we finish bottom 2, we deserve to be down. I can see the EFL arguing though that two of their members can't be relegated to a league where half a dozen are basically bankrupt and they are already a team down.

Another thing that rankles slightly is the fact that we would've been denied promotion last season if the National League didn't also agree to have relegation to the NLN/NLS. What's different this season?

 

[Back in the DHSS]

Another former Wrexham owner who had no links with the club was one Alex Hamilton who took the club for every penny he could. More often than not this is the case with a lot of football club chairman. Think Wrexham deserve a bit of luck for a change, so good luck to them.

 

[valefan16]

First off, I've got nothing against the NL sides currently in with a chance of winning promotion, in fact as you probably all know by now, I've been an advocate of 3 up 3 down for years. But thing is I'm not that sure there'll be relegation from L2 this season.

Grimsby, Barrow and Southend will almost certainly be supported by the other 21 clubs because all the other clubs know that it could very well be them in the near future and right now that's a cause for concern. For starters, you could have 7 NL clubs this season ending up fulfilling their fixtures with teams full of kids. It is bad enough when one team does it let alone seven.

I wouldn't be surprised if the EFL allows the two promoted teams to come up but scraps relegation for a year or two. 26 sides rather than the 24 for a season or two until matters are sorted out in the NL makes a lot of sense to me. Sending down two L2 sides into a league that is seemingly falling apart at the moment would be most unfair on the two sides.

It’s a complex mess.

As said before the salary cap has been mentioned by our CEO as possibly being an argument for any side relegated as they were restricted by a law that was found to be wrongly implemented so this could give the EFL an escape card if the clubs raise this.

If the league below is a sham and it looks likely it will be if teams refuse to play or throw the kids out then it’s hard to back throwing two member clubs into that mess.

The old pals act may come into play on this one as imagine one or more of the bottom three might raise the question at the next league meeting.