WWE Raw Discussion Thread

[Libertine]

Some good stuff this week. Exciting about the Divas but you can't help but worry they'll screw them up.

Thought Rollins was great at the end. Somehow I'm now getting the feeling he'll lose at BG. Maybe with Sheamus cashing in on Lesnar after.

 

[Christian Slater]

Some good stuff this week. Exciting about the Divas but you can't help but worry they'll screw them up.

Thought Rollins was great at the end. Somehow I'm now getting the feeling he'll lose at BG. Maybe with Sheamus cashing in on Lesnar after.

I think by grouping the Divas as they have it'll allow greater versatility to the division as well as protecting the ladies that have come up, a bit like The Shield. The biggest problem was the lack of numbers, if they continue to give them the time I think we will witness the best period for the women ever, no pun intended. I think they missed a trick by not having Lita involved in the segment seeing as she was there.

 

[Luke]

Not a bad raw, the divas angle was decent, triple threat match was superb and Lesnar/Rollins stuff was okay.

I don't watch NXT, were Charlotte & Becky faces on there and Becky a heel? That divas angle was superb and like said I hope they don't screw it up.

Disapointed Cody is carrying on with Stardust, I really hoped he would go back to Cody, said that long before Dusty's passing but if there was ever a time to do it it was now, hopefully he will soon.

Literally no idea where they are going to go Sunday night with the Lesnar/Rollins match, should be a good one. Hope New Day win the titles back as well, not a huge PTP fan in truth.

 

[Hooray]

I don't watch NXT, were Charlotte & Becky faces on there and Becky a heel? That divas angle was superb and like said I hope they don't screw it up.

They've all been switching between face and heel, to be honest! Sasha was a tame face when she first arrived, then joined forced with Charlotte and Summer Rae as the BFFs (Beautiful Fierce Females) and they were heels. When Summer Rae went to the main roster, Charlotte gradually turned face, and Sasha established herself as the biggest female heel on the roster, joining forces with Becky Lynch (who had previously been a face). Becky then gradually turned face and had an awesome match with Sasha for the title. Whilst all this was going on, the only constant was Bayley, who has been a face ever since she debuted really. Bayley is currently injured I believe, and should probably think herself unlucky that she's not included in the current main roster angle. I guess this will allow her to hopefully become NXT women's champion (long overdue), before getting the call-up later in the year.

Got that?

 

[Leewilson]

It just annoys me that you have bloody Alicia Fox out there when Natalya is sat out back. She would have been an asset to this angle.

 

[NiallQuinnDiscoPants]

It just annoys me that you have bloody Alicia Fox out there when Natalya is sat out back. She would have been an asset to this angle.

Alicia Fox is more deserving of a spot than god damn Tamina. Tamina stands out like the sore, clumsy, uncoordinated thumb in that group of women.

 

[Leewilson]

Alicia Fox is more deserving of a spot than god damn Tamina. Tamina stands out like the sore, clumsy, uncoordinated thumb in that group of women.

Oh god yeah, I forgot about Tamina.

 

[Eamonn]

Cesaro pinned Rusev clean on Smackdown

Very good match and hopefully his push continues

 

[NiallQuinnDiscoPants]

Personal opinion, i don't like where Summerslam is heading.

So we've got this Undertaker Lesnar match that everyone needs to have. I think Raw was pretty great as far as the build to that match goes, but I can't see both guys turning up every Monday before Summerslam to promote that. I think that's pretty much it for a few weeks as far as live Lesnar & Taker interaction goes.

Nope the worst thing for me is the Cena v Rollins match that looks scheduled for Summerslam for the WWE Title. Was reading on the PPV thread and someone had it nailed on that the US Open Challenge was about someone stepping up and beating John Cena. Many good young wrestlers have done this and failed. Owens didn't fail, but he got flattened by Cena eventually. Now Owens is going back to the NXT Title. And Cena is on Raw basically challenging Rollins for the WWE Title. God awful. I'll give the direction of Cena credit over this summer as it's been new and fresh, but creative are just ruining this by going back to the old 'CENA IN WWE TITLE HUNT' story fucking again. Good god. You get the great side of Cena in that he can have bloody great matches with new fresh talent, and then you have him inserted back in with Rollins who he's faced 3 times in 3 PPV's already over the period of November / January.

And I have a horrible feeling they're putting the belt on Cena.

 

[Eamonn]

I thought it was a great Raw, loved the Taker/Lesnar stuff, 2 good Divas matches and main event was actually quite enjoyable. If Wyatts/Shield gets a no DQ stipulation then that could be a great match. I really hope its not Cena vs Rollins, I could easily see unfortuantely Cena losing the title on Raw due to Rollins distraction which would be shit as someone needs the rub of beating Cena clean to take that title. Why not just do a tournament for the next number one contender, have Cesaro win it, get Rollins vs Cesaro at Summerslam so we get a fantastic match before Taker/Lesnar, Rollins finally wins clean but in doing so Sheamus comes out and cashes in. Have Cena vs Owens one more time, last man standing match, Owens wins, no fucking about, Owens makes Cena not able to stand up for a 10 count. Cena then moves on to try and win the one title hes never won, the IC title.

 

[T.A]

Poor Rusev

 

[NiallQuinnDiscoPants]

Poor Rusev

Put the 'kiss your new gf in front of your old gf' aside, damn Rusev was the biggest face on the show.

 

[T.A]

I really like him, not sure he could ever be face and it not get stale after a while tho.

 

[kopite]

It would be a crying shame after all the effort the U.S.open challenge and great moments is delivered...Cena ends up losing on a Raw with Rollins interference.

Rollins vs Cena does make sense...Rollins faced everyone more or less for the title except for the 'main' guy. Storyline writes itself.

However Cena winning the title with Sheamus cashing in scares me. Sheamus is as interesting as paint drying and an Autumn of Cena chasing him sounds a yawn fest.

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

Personal opinion, i don't like where Summerslam is heading.

So we've got this Undertaker Lesnar match that everyone needs to have. I think Raw was pretty great as far as the build to that match goes, but I can't see both guys turning up every Monday before Summerslam to promote that. I think that's pretty much it for a few weeks as far as live Lesnar & Taker interaction goes.

Nope the worst thing for me is the Cena v Rollins match that looks scheduled for Summerslam for the WWE Title. Was reading on the PPV thread and someone had it nailed on that the US Open Challenge was about someone stepping up and beating John Cena. Many good young wrestlers have done this and failed. Owens didn't fail, but he got flattened by Cena eventually. Now Owens is going back to the NXT Title. And Cena is on Raw basically challenging Rollins for the WWE Title. God awful. I'll give the direction of Cena credit over this summer as it's been new and fresh, but creative are just ruining this by going back to the old 'CENA IN WWE TITLE HUNT' story fucking again. Good god. You get the great side of Cena in that he can have bloody great matches with new fresh talent, and then you have him inserted back in with Rollins who he's faced 3 times in 3 PPV's already over the period of November / January.

And I have a horrible feeling they're putting the belt on Cena.

that would not surprise me, WWE are hitting their worst slump viewers wise since WCW was owning them and as they usually do WWE are in a big massive panic......Hense Lesnar is back, Hense Undertaker is back and yep I'd guess Cena or Orton will get the belt.

problem is that puts WWE right back into their vicious circle where they do not trust their new stars and won't accept its a transitional period which should help them longer term.

they just need to stick through it for once or else they'll have the same problem again next summer when the same stuff is tried

well that or create a strong heel, but since WWe has not done that properly now for about 10 years I cannot see it happening, they have lost the creativity of being a heel, surprising considering the 2 main guys are Mr McMahon and HHH........the 2 best ever heels.

 

[Stevencc]

That Taker and Lesnar stuff on Raw.

God help me I loved it.

 

[Christian Slater]

I love it when the show is dictated by backstage segments. I enjoyed this Raw but, like DiscoPants, I'm not exactly thrilled with where Summerslam is heading. I fear they're going to abandon a lot of hard work in building guys just to market to the casual fan.

Undertaker and Lesnar going at it was good, the only problem is there's another 5 weeks until they fight and they've blown their load on the first Raw of build. That's the kind of shit you do on the go-home.

 

[Eamonn]

Just when I was warming to Cena again as well but ultimately Cena has almost literally went over the entire roster and every top NXT star just for fun as well. I could go with him winning a alot as it as going to lead to the big pay off when a young star finally overcomes him but alas it looks like this will no longer be the case. He then goes on to completely annihilate Rollins character and devalue the WWE title. The only slight redeement would be if Rollins goes over Cena clean in a bid to prove he is the best, maybe have Cena give up the US title for a shot at the WWE title or something then have Owens/Cesaro/Rusev/Ziggler fatal 4 way for the vacant belt at Summerslam.

 

[Stevencc]

Just saw Raw's main event and it was absolutely hilarious, poor Rusev

 

[Libertine]

From the poster for SS I saw last night it does look like Cena v Rollins. Yawn.

The Lesnar v Taker stuff was awesome. Actually got me excited about it a little.

Loved the ending on Rusev too, haha.

 

[Who Needs Mourinho]

The Lesnar/Undertaker stuff was great reminded me of when the WWE actually gave a shit, same with the Divas.

 

[Oaf]

I'll give the direction of Cena credit over this summer as it's been new and fresh, but creative are just ruining this by going back to the old 'CENA IN WWE TITLE HUNT' story fucking again. Good god.

Yes it's Cena back in the title hunt, but to be fair it's only going to be his second title match of the entire year... and throughout all of 2014 and 2015 so far, he's held the title for a grand total of 2 months, which ended with him getting annihilated by Lesnar. Which is actually the sort of good, risky move that I like to see WWE making. Because regardless of anything else, Cena is still the guy in that company (and will be until he retires).

With that in mind, I don't really see a problem with Cena going into Summerslam to face Seth. In fact, I think it's a pretty great move. Like Kopite said, Seth has basically gone through most of the real challenges for the title, Cena is one of the few left, plus he's one of the biggest. And yes, Cena may win it, but then again, everybody on here was telling me how Lesnar was going to be walking out of Battleground with the title too. WWE are absolutely letting Seth run with it so far and have had utter faith in him to carry that title for a long time (Which he has been worthy of)... I don't expect Seth to come out of the match clean at all, but it's entirely possible that he'll come out of it with the title.

For me, the big feud that Seth must surely be leading to is Rollins vs Reigns... Reigns is the other guy who had the title "stolen" off of him at WM, and he's still yet to get his revenge match at a PPV. In fact, I'd actually imagine that match happening once Seth has dealt with Cena and then Reigns beating Seth for the title (possibly overcoming a cashing in Sheamus afterwards as well?)... they want Reigns to look strong, clearly, so letting him beat the guy who survives John Cena would be good for him.

It may be "Cena back in the WWE title hunt" again, but at least it's far better right now than it has been in pretty much the entirety of Cena's career. And it does make sense.

problem is that puts WWE right back into their vicious circle where they do not trust their new stars and won't accept its a transitional period which should help them longer term.

To be fair though...

Reigns dominated the rumble twice in a row (winning one of them), won superstar of the year and main evented Wrestlemania.
Seth Rollins has held the title since Wrestlemania.
Owens became like the 6th guy to ever beat Cena clean.
Ambrose has been main eventing PPV's all over the place.
Wyatt has main evented a couple of PPV's late last year as well.

I dunno. They may not have the level of trust you want them to have, but for me they're actually doing a great job of having faith in some of the new guys and letting them have a chance to carry a PPV/Raw as of late. Like the above arguement with Cena, I'd say maybe it's not as flawless a record as you want but again, let's not pretend that it's not in the best state that it's been for a long, long time on the matter.

 

[Eamonn]

I'm sure the match would be good but we have seen Cena/Rollins numerous times, not for the title no and Rollins/Reigns we have also seen quite a few times, I dont really want to see either. Unless Rollins is going to change his character or even turn face I have little interest in his reign and wouldnt mind him losing it soon...just not to Cena! And Cenas reign needs to end with him putting someone over just like Undertaker shouldnt beat Lesnar as again it wastes the rub of beating the streak winner. I personally think Rollins should turn face soon especially if Sheamus is going to cash in soon and Ambrose should turn heel. It opens up so many fresh feuds and perspectives, Rollins as a fighting face champion would be a lot better, Rollins/Sheamus, Rollins/Wyatt, Rollins/HHH, Rollins/Owens, Rollins/Rusev, Rollins/Ambrose with alliances reversed would be interesting again. There isnt much more scope in Rollins in this heel role for me, hes pretty much out of faces and interesting matchups unless someone like Cesaro got a push.

 

[kopite]

problem is that puts WWE right back into their vicious circle where they do not trust their new stars and won't accept its a transitional period which should help them longer term.

they just need to stick through it for once or else they'll have the same problem again next summer when the same stuff is tried

well that or create a strong heel, but since WWe has not done that properly now for about 10 years I cannot see it happening, they have lost the creativity of being a heel, surprising considering the 2 main guys are Mr McMahon and HHH........the 2 best ever heels.

To be fair Seth Rollins is a really well made heel. Randy Orton is at his best when he's a heel but they blow hot and cold with him. One year he's the main heel then as a face he disappears into mid card obscurity. Then you got Wyatt who is over but has been used pretty badly and Rusev.

In terms of WWE not trusting their new guys, well I think they are in a tough position. Like Oaf mentioned they really pulled the trigger on Reigns when he was massively over then the fans decided they don't like him anymore and as a result he didn't get his Wrestlemania moment and the title.

As soon as Cesaro was over, they put him in with Heyman but that didn't come across well then he got dumped into a tag team with Tyson Kidd....credit to both of them for making that work.

Vicious circle is they try to make new stars but audiences are really fickle and turn on the new guys they try to make.

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

I can 100% see your point Oaf and I am harsh to say they do not push anyone, but the problem is they have been doing that for afew years now just shoving someone in and hoping for the best and it hasn't worked really at all......You can think of lots who got their time at the top, but it died out they went back to the same old and then the others disappear into nothing.

but yep you are correct WWE do give them a chance, but clearly either they way they are built, the way they are introduced, the way they push them creatively or some sort've interaction to the fan base is massively wrong. They should not be needing to dig out Lesnar, Undertaker, Rock etc, etc

If we looked back to that mania 17 which I know as such was the best period, but filter across the card and you cared about nearly the whole of the lower-mid card....Regal, Jericho, RTC, Dudleys, Hardys, E&C, Angle, Benoit, Guerrero, APA, Saturn, Big Show, Kane........20 odd lower-mid card guys who people cared about one way or other.

and then of the ones of that group who broke finally into the ME nearly all of them kept involved with the fans apart from probably Christian, Matt Hardy and maybe Kane as he never quite fully got over there.


What we need to ask is where is that moment when the new guys are going wrong from a popular to not cared about point, which clearly wasn't a problem previous. Is it how they start, how they are built or what they do when finally there??? I suppose that links to what kopite says because is this lack of trust a WWE or Fan problem.

It may not seem a problem now, but its an urgent one, Wrestling isn't in a good place right now, the indie scene is shrinking the alternative product will soon be dead and the main product is suffering a slump in numbers, Wrestling needs WWE doing well to boost everywhere else.

 

[Eamonn]

To be fair Seth Rollins is a really well made heel. Randy Orton is at his best when he's a heel but they blow hot and cold with him. One year he's the main heel then as a face he disappears into mid card obscurity. Then you got Wyatt who is over but has been used pretty badly and Rusev.

In terms of WWE not trusting their new guys, well I think they are in a tough position. Like Oaf mentioned they really pulled the trigger on Reigns when he was massively over then the fans decided they don't like him anymore and as a result he didn't get his Wrestlemania moment and the title.

As soon as Cesaro was over, they put him in with Heyman but that didn't come across well then he got dumped into a tag team with Tyson Kidd....credit to both of them for making that work.

Vicious circle is they try to make new stars but audiences are really fickle and turn on the new guys they try to make.

Cesaro got over huge as a face so what do WWE do? They turn him heel put him with Heyman who ONLY mentions Brock Lesnar and does nothing to promote or push Cesaro. The booking is the problem, the audiences arent fickle, WWE doesnt like anyone who gets over themselves, Ryder got buried, Sandow dared to get over and now theyve buried him - how Sandow got dumped down the card was quite disgraceful to be honest, the guy can talk, entertain and wrestle. If these guys arent on TV for weeks/months the audience hasnt turned on them, they are forgotten about. Reigns got the "superman" push too fast, he needed a midcard title and upper run for a year before the WM main event, Reigns/Rusev would have been good for Reigns to end the undefeated streak but of course Cena had to do it and go over just like Cena has went over almost every single person on the roster this year and pretty much in NXT also, Owens, Zayn, Neville, Ambrose, Rollins, Barrett, Cesaro, Wyatt.

 

[Eamonn]

In other shocking news, Hogan has been pulled from all things WWE, dropped as Tough Enough judge, all references to have have been removed from the WWE website and merchandise and they've even dropped Axels gimmick!

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

I remember you lot used to go mad on Sandow and he's never mentioned anymore, so do you think the main problem could be abit of arrogance from them at top of WWE? That people have to go over their way or not at all?

It seems strange if that was case when they always hype on that Austin and Rock got over as they just 'ran with fan reactions'

That is one of my big gripes with NXT it takes people ready for the roster and removes the individual aspects that made them popular elsewhere.......the likes of the dudleys, Guerrero, Benoit and Jericho would not have been as over but for keeping their personalities gained elsewhere.

and why they've always had it in for Bryan I've never understood.

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

In other shocking news, Hogan has been pulled from all things WWE, dropped as Tough Enough judge, all references to have have been removed from the WWE website and merchandise and they've even dropped Axels gimmick!

got to be some major major story coming in with the guy, they have even removed his Hall of Fame section..........any little piece of info that said he was in WWE has been wiped from all accounts.

 

[Eamonn]

A lot of rumour its do with racist comments, I'm sure it will all come out at some point today