Managerial Merry-Go-Round 2020/21

[joethegill]

I couldn't give a shit what sort of football we play as long as it's winning football. If we can win and score 3/4 every week then wonderful, but I didn't complain at the 1-0s at the start of the season and I certainly wouldn't mind more of the same.

The squad we have could go several ways - we could play some direct stuff but we'd need a bigger centre forward if Hawkins is out for as long as rumoured, as Bonne/Nichols/Nadesan just aren't that guy. We can play good, on the deck stuff as well as we have some lovely technical players in the squad, and we could play an aggressive pressing style with the players currently in the squad as well. Important to not get caught in between a mixture of things though, I hope Clemence comes in with a plan of how he wants to play and we just do that rather than try to be too clever and end up not looking like we have any sort of coherent game plan whatsoever.

 

[saddler78]

Agree with the attractive passing football comments. Passing the ball between full backs via the keeper is not attractive. That wonderful Barca side rarely involved the keeper in this. The ball was passed forward mostly.

Re Etherington. Glad he has been reappointed but if that clause was in his contract he probably is breaking the terms. 6 months unemployed should negate it but I don't think it does.

Casey

Agree try and play like that at this level you will get kicked off the park mostly.

 

[Pilot_Phonic]

1st league game? Of course, fucking Wrexham!

 

[THE LAST WALTZ]

1st league game? Of course, fucking Wrexham!

Let’s hope for the old ‘new manager bounce’

 

[Indian Dan]

Agree with the attractive passing football comments. Passing the ball between full backs via the keeper is not attractive. That wonderful Barca side rarely involved the keeper in this. The ball was passed forward mostly.

Re Etherington. Glad he has been reappointed but if that clause was in his contract he probably is breaking the terms. 6 months unemployed should negate it but I don't think it does.

Casey

Of course, the main reason for the fannying around at the back is that most L2 defenders aren’t comfortable receiving the ball if there is an opposition player breathing down their neck. So to try and avoid getting caught out their first instinct is to get shot by passing, mainly, backwards or, at best, sideways.

 

[Pilot_Phonic]

Let’s hope for the old ‘new manager bounce’

Let's not

 

[GTFCfish]

The problem with the possession based game plan in L2 is that it’s relatively easy for L2 cloggers to negate the fancy Dan players into making mistakes. The trade off is gambling that the majority of chances given up by fannying around at the back aren’t capitalised upon by most L2 strikers.

Watching 20-pass moves that lead to a goal look good in hindsight - the 18 or 19 passes leading up to it are boring to watch. It’s an atmosphere killer as watching the ball being knocked around between the CBs hardly gets the pulses racing.

Yep we used to try playing it out from the back under Holloway:

 

[Indian Dan]

Interesting

 

[joethegill]

Interesting

What on earth is a pass and carry stat?

 

[Indian Dan]

Got to say, I’m not a great fan of stats

 

[ForzaCounty]

What on earth is a pass and carry stat?

It's more spreadsheet wankerism

https://twitter.com/x/status/1719475861991153981

 

[クレイグ]

Just happy there isn't an expected to make a manager appointment sometime soon stat.

 

[Indian Dan]

Yeah. What the hell is going on with you lot? Must be a month now.

 

[クレイグ]

Aye it's 4 weeks today. Absolutely no idea to be honest, Dan. Was hoping we'd get someone in before the FA Cup game on Saturday, but that isn't happening.

 

[Indian Dan]

Long as you get right, I suppose.

 

[The_Viking_Magpie]

I'm certainly interested to see who Bradford and Grimsby plump for / or get however you want to view it.

MK and Gills have made the call and got their man. Now for the lower placed clubs to do the same.

 

[pontoonlew]

I think it’s inevitable we’ll end up with a coach that nobody has even mentioned so far, it’s likely to be a few weeks as well I’d imagine. That’s unless Gareth Jennings has something up his sleeve already.

 

[LS Bantam]

The recent names mentioned have all been worse than the last, Holden, Boothroyd, etc. each time it focuses you on who you really want (from what is a very uninspiring list) and for me the Cowley’s are the stand out choice.
We’re so desperate to do well I don’t think a first time coach will be given the role simply on lack of experience, at the minimum I want someone who can at least say ‘I did well here by doing this, we achieved this, we strengthened that’, not Dean Holden say who says ‘oh well I’ve never lasted more than 9 months and have been sacked by every single club’.

 

[Casey]

Manager finally confirmed
View attachment 19352

Oh! We're not good enough to steal from anymore?

Seriously, good luck with.

Casey

 

[Gi Dalor]

The recent names mentioned have all been worse than the last, Holden, Boothroyd, etc. each time it focuses you on who you really want (from what is a very uninspiring list) and for me the Cowley’s are the stand out choice.
We’re so desperate to do well I don’t think a first time coach will be given the role simply on lack of experience, at the minimum I want someone who can at least say ‘I did well here by doing this, we achieved this, we strengthened that’, not Dean Holden say who says ‘oh well I’ve never lasted more than 9 months and have been sacked by every single club’.

Dean Holden doesn't have a good record anywhere. One can say, maybe he'd have won more games than he lost if he'd been given the opportunity to stay longer, but the fact that he's been denied that opportunity 3 times seems significant.
He's basically a guy that's failed repeatedly at higher levels. Honest question. is there a manager who did that, but then was successful consistently at a lower level?

 

[Son of Cod]

A real embarrassment that clubs with no vision sack their manager merely to appease fans then have no clear succession plan.

Some of these executives behind the decisions couldn't run a bath. Especially that Ryan Sparks at Bradford.

This is what has disappointed me about the Hurst sacking. In a matter of weeks he's gone from paramount to our long term vision to being sacked off the back of a relatively short run of poor form (I'll come back to this).

I'm also really surprised that I'm very much in the outlier category on this in terms of our support. Some very short memories being flexed considering we suffered a much more severe loss of form less than two years ago and Hurst was given time and guided us to promotion, the FA Cup QFs and our highest finish since 2006. It 100% boils down to fan pressure and the outcome is grimly reminiscent of the Fenty era. Weeks of Fishy unrest, ownership eventually buckles. Stockwood's interview offers no real reason for the sacking. The language is wishy washy and he trots out phrases such as "the performances haven't been bad" and "we're not getting the rub of the green" while stating he believes we have the quality to rise up the table. It all just seems a bit short sighted.

I'm by no means saying Hurst is blameless. Allowing Crocombe to leave and replacing him with Eastwood was a terrible call. Pyke looks like an absolute duffer of a signing. The midfield is once again lacking any real creativity (yet Alex Hunt remains sidelined or brought in for single matches once every six weeks). There's no real cohesion or plan and Hurst didn't seemed to know his best XI.

It's his squad at the end of the day, but for me that's all the more reason to give him a bit longer. Attacking wise, we're starting to click. It's the defence that has been dropping clangers and I don't think there's a better manager in this division to sort a defence out as there is Hurst. He's also had Rose and Wilson fit and together for such a small handful of matches which is a shame. Vernam's out for ages too, who was probably our flagship signing of the summer. Hurst shouldn't also be held fully accountable for Eisa spooning the ball over from half a yard out when he's got an open net or Rodgers being skinned in the area about six yards out or Eastwood flapping at a cross.

I've gone incredibly optimistic here so hear me out before you all call me out on this as I'm coming at it from the perspective that this is the best case scenario, but I've gone through our fixtures and amended our points total to reflect what kind of realistically could have happened if we'd got the rub of the green on every major decision/chance that has settled matches.

Wimbledon (h) 0-0 - fair result - 1 point
Notts (a) 2-3 defeat - outplayed but not massively so, Notts scored a freak OG - 2 points
Salford (h) 2-0 win - deserved to win this one 5 points
Mansfield (h) 1-1 - one of the two matches this season in which we came away with something we shouldn't have, Mansfield the far better side 5 points
Walsall (a) 1-1 - Danny Rose misses a golden opportunity for us when we're 1-0 up and cruising, we were well on top for most of the second half after a fairly boring first half 8 points
Gillingham (h) 2-0 win - deserved to win this one 11 points
Bradford (a) 1-1 - Bradford equalised in the last few mins with their only shot of the match after we'd been the better side 14 points
Wrexham (a) 0-3 defeat - no complaints at all here, well and truly comfortably beaten, Hurst got his tactics all wrong 14 points
Crawley (h) 2-3 defeat - fairly even match, late Danny Orsi winner scrambled home for them 15 points
Swindon (a) 1-2 defeat - much the better side in the second half, we were definitely worth a point 16 points
Barrow (h) 2-1 win - got away with the points here, won't take all three in my imaginary fantasy points tally as Barrow definitely deserved something 17 points
Tranmere (a) 2-2 - wasn't a classic, but we were probably the better side and had chances to win it 20 points
Accrington (h) 0-2 defeat - Absolute pish match that was petering out to a 0-0 before Waterfall gets sent off for a second yellow after winning the ball for the first, then they score a screamer and a raggy second 21 points
Stockport (a) 2-3 defeat - Stockport should have been out of sight by half time, ripped us a new one and were up there with Mansfield as the best team we've seen....for 45 minutes. We came out and bossed the second half, drew level from 2-0 down and then they score from a contentiously awarded set piece 22 points
Colchester (h) 2-3 defeat - how the fuck we lost this, I don't know. All over them for the vast majority of the second half and they win it with the kind of deflected pot shot that only goes in when you're 20th in the league and haven't won in ages 23 points
Donny (a) 0-1 defeat - didn't watch this but by all accounts it was an even match with us perhaps edging it if anything 24 points

Okay okay okay...I know what you're thinking, this is all ifs and buts and couldda wouldda shoulddas and I'm not disagreeing with any counter argument of that nature because every team can go through their fixtures and point to these kind of things but what is clear from breaking our games down is that a) we have been desperately unlucky an inordinately high amount of times and b) only Wrexham have done us with any ease and looked comfortable doing so. I've talked before about the fine margins of Hurstball and that it's a risky way to play and it's been his undoing this season, however I genuinely believe we're in a false position right now. The players were playing for Hurst. How many teams have come back at Stockport in their own backyard like we did less than two weeks ago? That wasn't the performance of a side that needed an overhaul. We just needed to ride it out as we've seen several times throughout both of Hurst's stints with us that we always come out stronger and more together than before when we've faced adversity.

Stockwood and Pettit under massive pressure to get this appointment right now as we've ditched a safe pair of hands. I can't see how we bring in a better manager than Hurst without tempting one of the ones that looks like an unrealistic option. I pray to God that we're not shopping in the Gibraltar market when perilously poised just above the drop zone from the EFL once again.

 

[Stocky]

Has Hurst commented yet? Surely the Grimsby fans would love to hear from him or have him back at a game soon and give a good reception?

Maybe it's still too raw for him and he's hurting as much as anyone. He always seemed a stiff upper lip Yorkshireman but he could be forgiven for being upset at how he's been treated by the club

To have him sent packing to his car and him having to saying goobye to the players before they go home on the team bus was extremely classless from Jason Stockwood. I wonder if he'll put that in his Guardian column.

 

[Son of Cod]

Has Hurst commented yet? Surely the Grimsby fans would love to hear from him or have him back at a game soon and give a good reception?

Maybe it's still too raw for him and he's hurting as much as anyone. He always seemed a stiff upper lip Yorkshireman but he could be forgiven for being upset at how he's been treated by the club

To have him sent packing to his car and him having to saying goobye to the players before they go home on the team bus was extremely classless from Jason Stockwood. I wonder if he'll put that in his Guardian column.

Not heard anything from Hurst, no. Apparently Doig (Hurst's assistant) was at a youth cup game a few days ago and went into the changing room to speak to the youth team. I'm hoping one of our pods might be able to get Hurst on for a show but I highly doubt he'll be up for it.

The car thing was a bit odd from the perspective that it must have been pre-arranged.

 

[Gi Dalor]

Nigel Adkins appointed permanent Tranmere Rovers manager

Tranmere Rovers are delighted to confirm that Nigel Adkins, who has been in interim charge of the team, has agreed a contract to stay with the Club in a permanent capacity as Manager until the end of the 2025/26 season.

www.tranmererovers.co.uk

 

[Cloudy]

This is what has disappointed me about the Hurst sacking. In a matter of weeks he's gone from paramount to our long term vision to being sacked off the back of a relatively short run of poor form (I'll come back to this).

I'm also really surprised that I'm very much in the outlier category on this in terms of our support. Some very short memories being flexed considering we suffered a much more severe loss of form less than two years ago and Hurst was given time and guided us to promotion, the FA Cup QFs and our highest finish since 2006. It 100% boils down to fan pressure and the outcome is grimly reminiscent of the Fenty era. Weeks of Fishy unrest, ownership eventually buckles. Stockwood's interview offers no real reason for the sacking. The language is wishy washy and he trots out phrases such as "the performances haven't been bad" and "we're not getting the rub of the green" while stating he believes we have the quality to rise up the table. It all just seems a bit short sighted.

I'm by no means saying Hurst is blameless. Allowing Crocombe to leave and replacing him with Eastwood was a terrible call. Pyke looks like an absolute duffer of a signing. The midfield is once again lacking any real creativity (yet Alex Hunt remains sidelined or brought in for single matches once every six weeks). There's no real cohesion or plan and Hurst didn't seemed to know his best XI.

It's his squad at the end of the day, but for me that's all the more reason to give him a bit longer. Attacking wise, we're starting to click. It's the defence that has been dropping clangers and I don't think there's a better manager in this division to sort a defence out as there is Hurst. He's also had Rose and Wilson fit and together for such a small handful of matches which is a shame. Vernam's out for ages too, who was probably our flagship signing of the summer. Hurst shouldn't also be held fully accountable for Eisa spooning the ball over from half a yard out when he's got an open net or Rodgers being skinned in the area about six yards out or Eastwood flapping at a cross.

I've gone incredibly optimistic here so hear me out before you all call me out on this as I'm coming at it from the perspective that this is the best case scenario, but I've gone through our fixtures and amended our points total to reflect what kind of realistically could have happened if we'd got the rub of the green on every major decision/chance that has settled matches.

Wimbledon (h) 0-0 - fair result - 1 point
Notts (a) 2-3 defeat - outplayed but not massively so, Notts scored a freak OG - 2 points
Salford (h) 2-0 win - deserved to win this one 5 points
Mansfield (h) 1-1 - one of the two matches this season in which we came away with something we shouldn't have, Mansfield the far better side 5 points
Walsall (a) 1-1 - Danny Rose misses a golden opportunity for us when we're 1-0 up and cruising, we were well on top for most of the second half after a fairly boring first half 8 points
Gillingham (h) 2-0 win - deserved to win this one 11 points
Bradford (a) 1-1 - Bradford equalised in the last few mins with their only shot of the match after we'd been the better side 14 points
Wrexham (a) 0-3 defeat - no complaints at all here, well and truly comfortably beaten, Hurst got his tactics all wrong 14 points
Crawley (h) 2-3 defeat - fairly even match, late Danny Orsi winner scrambled home for them 15 points
Swindon (a) 1-2 defeat - much the better side in the second half, we were definitely worth a point 16 points
Barrow (h) 2-1 win - got away with the points here, won't take all three in my imaginary fantasy points tally as Barrow definitely deserved something 17 points
Tranmere (a) 2-2 - wasn't a classic, but we were probably the better side and had chances to win it 20 points
Accrington (h) 0-2 defeat - Absolute pish match that was petering out to a 0-0 before Waterfall gets sent off for a second yellow after winning the ball for the first, then they score a screamer and a raggy second 21 points
Stockport (a) 2-3 defeat - Stockport should have been out of sight by half time, ripped us a new one and were up there with Mansfield as the best team we've seen....for 45 minutes. We came out and bossed the second half, drew level from 2-0 down and then they score from a contentiously awarded set piece 22 points
Colchester (h) 2-3 defeat - how the fuck we lost this, I don't know. All over them for the vast majority of the second half and they win it with the kind of deflected pot shot that only goes in when you're 20th in the league and haven't won in ages 23 points
Donny (a) 0-1 defeat - didn't watch this but by all accounts it was an even match with us perhaps edging it if anything 24 points

Okay okay okay...I know what you're thinking, this is all ifs and buts and couldda wouldda shoulddas and I'm not disagreeing with any counter argument of that nature because every team can go through their fixtures and point to these kind of things but what is clear from breaking our games down is that a) we have been desperately unlucky an inordinately high amount of times and b) only Wrexham have done us with any ease and looked comfortable doing so. I've talked before about the fine margins of Hurstball and that it's a risky way to play and it's been his undoing this season, however I genuinely believe we're in a false position right now. The players were playing for Hurst. How many teams have come back at Stockport in their own backyard like we did less than two weeks ago? That wasn't the performance of a side that needed an overhaul. We just needed to ride it out as we've seen several times throughout both of Hurst's stints with us that we always come out stronger and more together than before when we've faced adversity.

Stockwood and Pettit under massive pressure to get this appointment right now as we've ditched a safe pair of hands. I can't seen how we bring in a better manager than Hurst without tempting one of the ones that looks like an unrealistic option. I pray to God that we're not shopping in the Gibraltar market when perilously poised just above the drop zone from the EFL once again.

Having been in attendance at all but 2 of these games, I can only say imho, that this is bizarrely optimistic at best. The lack of attacking intent in most of the games has been Hurst’s downfall, turgid dull football. Not expecting Grimsby to be Man City or Barcelona but the whole board came to the decision, not just Stockwood. They all felt a change was necessary, most fans, like me, felt up to about 3 weeks ago that Hurst would turn it around, however performances got worse. He admitted he felt we just had to wait for results to turn, not offering anything about what he was going to do about it.
Managers tend to have a timeframe after which they become stale, need a new challenge, I very much feel Hurst needs a break before returning to management probably in the NL

 

[Pilot_Phonic]

Nigel Adkins appointed permanent Tranmere Rovers manager

Tranmere Rovers are delighted to confirm that Nigel Adkins, who has been in interim charge of the team, has agreed a contract to stay with the Club in a permanent capacity as Manager until the end of the 2025/26 season.

www.tranmererovers.co.uk

Who'd have thought...

Wonder how they have faired since his appt of the caretaker role. Doesn't look good from the outside.

 

[THE LAST WALTZ]

Oh! We're not good enough to steal from anymore?

Seriously, good luck with.

Casey

Hopefully you can get back on track now all the speculation about Scott has finished.
Your results seem to have taken a dip since this all kicked off.

 

[northstandexile]

Looking at Grimsby’s fixtures they have had a really tough set of fixtures against top teams whereas they have all the bottom half teams to play.
They have had a worse set of fixtures than Mansfield.

League Two run-in analysis

English League Two stats

www.soccerstats.com

 

[Conker]

I heard Hurst wanted out too, from a reasonable Sauce (seriously tho)

 

[The_Viking_Magpie]

If your football is dull and turgid especially for the huge travelling hoards and the results are frankly shit when playing the good, the bad and the average of L2 you gotta go. From the outside it looks like Grimbo weren't treading water this season they had noticeably regressed. Was the football dull last season also when winning more?