The Religion Thread

[Renegade]

This article is commentary on the book Islam without extremes by Mustafa Akyol. I feel it's a relevant read given discussions in the American shooting thread.

https://weeklysift.com/2015/01/26/liberal-islam-is-it-real-is-it-islam/

I have encountered quite a few Muslims that reject the Hadith and only follow the Qur'an. Do you think it's actually possible for the wider Islamic population to reject the Hadith in order to reform your religion, without having your religion "diluted"? Considering the Hadith was written by men other than Muhammad, would you reject all of the things it teaches and just stick to the Qur'an or ignore the teachings of the Hadith that go against a free secular society?

Genuinely interested, it seems like an incredibly ambitious and unlikely to catch on interpretation of your religion from the outside looking in. The Qur'an alone still has some damaging passages, but if you got the real damaging teachings from the Hadith out of your religion, then at that point it will probably be less of a threat than (current) Christianity to modern values.

 

[sl1k]

I have encountered quite a few Muslims that reject the Hadith and only follow the Qur'an. Do you think it's actually possible for the wider Islamic population to reject the Hadith in order to reform your religion, without having your religion "diluted"? Considering the Hadith was written by men other than Muhammad, would you reject all of the things it teaches and just stick to the Qur'an or ignore the teachings of the Hadith that go against a free secular society?

Genuinely interested, it seems like an incredibly ambitious and unlikely to catch on interpretation of your religion from the outside looking in. The Qur'an alone still has some damaging passages, but if you got the real damaging teachings from the Hadith out of your religion, then at that point it will probably be less of a threat than (current) Christianity to modern values.

It's a process that will take time, but as Muslim majority regions get better educated and meet different people with different ideas I'm confident it'll become the natural route. I mean, it's just common sense really, the Quran is the only text we accept to be divinely inspired so why people would attribute the same level of authority to man written hadiths is beyond me. They are teachings from people who are a product of their time, culture and society which make them pretty redundant now.

There's still a lot the hadiths offer, but there's no reason why people should feel obliged to accept the more damaging/ bad stuff.

 

[silkyman]

Was doorstepped this morning by a couple of old biddies trying to god the place up a bit.

I politely told them that they were barking up the wrong tree as I was a long-term atheist, and the look on their faces was incredible. It was like a lion had opened the door to them or something. They'd heard about atheists, they knew that they existed somewhere, but they certainly didn't expect one to be opening the door to them in Macclesfield.

They had a brief go at trying to tell me that the bible was really scientific, but just sort of gave up and walked off looking mildly offended.

 

[Jockney]

Was doorstepped this morning by a couple of old biddies trying to god the place up a bit.

I politely told them that they were barking up the wrong tree as I was a long-term atheist, and the look on their faces was incredible. It was like a lion had opened the door to them or something. They'd heard about atheists, they knew that they existed somewhere, but they certainly didn't expect one to be opening the door to them in Macclesfield.

They had a brief go at trying to tell me that the bible was really scientific, but just sort of gave up and walked off looking mildly offended.

Fighting the humanist cause one Doris at a time!

 

[silkyman]

Using the evil tactic of smiling politely.

 

[Carver]

I believe in God.

 

[Martino Quackavelli]

i bet they were terrified at an atheist opening the door to them. grabbing their prayer beads and brandishing garlic crucifixes to ward off the bearded, obese, fedora-waving spectre haunting the doorway; the jowely apparition waving a copy of the god delusion and panting lines from hitchens' classics. i mean u guys are normally such an unobtrusive people, especially on the realms of the internet where i know u guys make it a point not to tell everyone and anyone all the time that, yes, we are atheists. it's no wonder they've never encountered anyone on the atheistic/agnostic spectrum in our theocratic little isles. u showed dem tho, mate

 

[silkyman]

No, I er, smiled politely.

I could, had it been required, laid my hands on a copy of The God Delusion, but it didn't seem to be.

 

[silkyman]

I believe in God.

Which one(s)?

 

[Christian Slater]

Silky has definitely moved a Bible into the fiction section at a library.

 

[Carver]

Which one(s)?

Christian God.

 

[Christian Slater]

Flattered.

 

[blade1889]

Had a guy come to my door talking about God too yesterday. He asked if I wanted a leaflet and I said no thanks because I wouldn't read it anyway. He said that's ok and wished me a nice day and I did likewise.

 

[silkyman]

Christian God.

Isn't it lucky that you were born and brought up in part of the world where the 'right' religion is the traditional and cultural one generally supported.

 

[silkyman]

Incidentally, I'm probably well behind the curve because the videos are a few years old, but I've stumbled across this lot, who do quite a good job of unpicking some of the hypocracy and contradictions.

https://m.youtube.com/user/NonStampCollector

 

[Carver]

Isn't it lucky that you were born and brought up in part of the world where the 'right' religion is the traditional and cultural one generally supported.

Yes Im happy to be brought up in the Western world and it bewilders me as to how in this day and age we still let the rest of the world fall behind. When will the rest of the world get their act together and realise that their cultures are the reason for why they're in so much poverty and have such poor living standards? It is no wonder so many want to migrate to the West and no one wants to go to their countries.

 

[silkyman]

Those Iron Age Palestinians really had their acts together...

 

[AFCB_Mark]

Yes Im happy to be brought up in the Western world and it bewilders me as to how in this day and age we still let the rest of the world fall behind. When will the rest of the world get their act together and realise that their cultures are the reason for why they're in so much poverty and have such poor living standards? It is no wonder so many want to migrate to the West and no one wants to go to their countries.

The irony being that the Persians and later the Moors were some of the most advanced and enlightened thinkers of their times.

 

[Carver]

I think that anywhere in the world that isn't North America, Western Europe, Australia, New Zealand and maybe Japan.

Is a genuine shithole!

Am I right?

 

[mnb089mnb]

Those videos above are terrible.

The cartoon ones.

The sewer one features less shit.

 

[Martino Quackavelli]

don't feed the wum please

doc tob

appreciative of our mods and their efforts

 

[mnb089mnb]

don't feed the wum please

doc tob

appreciative of our mods and their efforts

Thanks.

Can you do something about the adverts? Cheers.

 

[Stevencc]

Did you guys know that Silkyman doesn't approve of religions because he sees them as cults and he already partakes in more than enough cultish behaviour every weekend when he watches his beloved Manchester City Football Club play football?

 

[Carver]

Did you guys know that Silkyman doesn't approve of religions because he sees them as cults and he already partakes in more than enough cultish behaviour every weekend when he watches his beloved Manchester City Football Club play football?

Exactly!

He's a fucking hypocrite.

 

[silkyman]

Those videos above are terrible.

The cartoon ones.

The sewer one features less shit.

Not exactly the highest production values, but the message is fair. There's so much contradiction in all of it.

 

[NorfolkWomble]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...-says-it-may-allow-female-officers-to-wear-f/

 

[sl1k]

It isn't obligatory for Muslim women to wear the Burka so I find this move by the police force odd - especially considering they already allow hijabs which is sufficient for their needs. If anything, it just gives opportunists like NW references for their narratives/underlying agendas and does nothing for community cohesion. The police are also supposed to be a symbol of security and authority, it seems rather inappropriate to have faceless officers.

 

[NorfolkWomble]

It isn't obligatory for Muslim women to wear the Burka so I find this move by the police force odd - especially considering they already allow hijabs which is sufficient for their needs. If anything, it just gives opportunists like NW references for their narratives/underlying agendas and does nothing for community cohesion. The police are also supposed to be a symbol of security and authority, it seems rather inappropriate to have faceless officers.

What is my supposed underlying agenda? I keep forgetting.

There have been studies done which prove that faceless officers (ie riot mask) result in whoever they are interacting with being more violent than non-faceless ones. Also, surely a burka could easily be grabbed? Quite easy to disorientate someone if they are wearing headgear.

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

The police uniform should be as irreligious as possible.

 

[SUTSS]

I don't think it's a particularly controversial viewpoint to not want state officials, especially police officers, to wear overtly religious clothing.