Watford v Liverpool - Sun 20th Dec 13:30

[RavenBish]

Yes I agree. Add that to the increasing finances available to the Premier League clubs. Mid table teams are picking up real talent from other countries, for example West Ham pulling in Payet from one of the top French teams.

No-one seems to be batting an eyelid at the fact Watford are just about to drop 20m euros on Iturbe either. Leicester could genuinely go out and prise some top players from France, Germany and Italy if they wanted to in January and consolidate a push for top 4.

It's horribly exposed just how bad the scouting strategies of the likes of Man Utd and Liverpool must be as well.

 

[JimJams]

It's tactics, hunger and belief

Why isn't it player quality?

 

[Cheese & Biscuits]

Just seen the table. Hadn't realised how high Watford (and Palace) are and how shit Liverpool are doing.

Great to see a few upsetting the status quo this year. Long may it continue.

 

[G.B]

Why isn't it player quality?

something, something, 4-2-3-1 killing the game

 

[elnino65]

Why isn't it player quality?

because the value of a squad means nothing

 

[JimJams]

Which brings us back to my question...

 

[Spear]

 

[thespus]

There are Liverpool fans who bang on about Sakho being better than Koscielny.

 

[johnnytodd]

i think deluded Liverpool fans ( normally cockney's or Scandanavians) pile too much pressure on the team to win everything and they end up winning fuck all..............if they were a bit more level headed and realised they are a top 10 team at best the team may play more freely.

 

[elnino65]

Which brings us back to my question...

It's about player quality to an extent, but it's the combativeness of the midfield in most teams being used that is triumphing prodiminantly, look at the top 4 or 5 teams in the BPL, they're the ones getting the results and being able to eek or splash out their goals through good players, giroud, vardy, kane. it's easier to get results through defence than it is through pure attack, which is why the 4-2-3-1 and 4-4-2 are both bringing success for teams with confidence in their setup, a solid formation that is guarenteed a narrow scoreline (90% of the time) and an evenly contested game, and the other one with 2 banks of 4 which teams will be susceptible to the counter against

 

[elnino65]

i think deluded Liverpool fans ( normally cockney's or Scandanavians) pile too much pressure on the team to win everything and they end up winning fuck all..............if they were a bit more level headed and realised they are a top 10 team at best the team may play more freely.

like everton fans then

 

[snortingfrogs]

We were so shit today I'm fucking embarrassed.

 

[kopite]

Another lost opportunity to close the gap on top 4...it's not really a lost opportunity because we're not getting anywhere near champions league when you have disasters in goal and defence.

January is a shite window, I think we just have to accept Klopp has to deal with what he's got till next summer and try to get us a Wembley trip.

Riyadh Mahrez will rip Moreno to shreds on boxing day and Vardy will have a field day. I'll be shocked if Leicester dont score at least 3.

Credit to Watford, Deeney and Ighalo are a top partnership and I hope they start getting proper credit. Leicester and Palace kept them under the radar.

 

[elnino65]

Another lost opportunity to close the gap on top 4...it's not really a lost opportunity because we're not getting anywhere near champions league when you have disasters in goal and defence.

January is a shite window, I think we just have to accept Klopp has to deal with what he's got till next summer and try to get us a Wembley trip.

Riyadh Mahrez will rip Moreno to shreds on boxing day and Vardy will have a field day. I'll be shocked if Leicester dont score at least 3.

Credit to Watford, Deeney and Ighalo are a top partnership and I hope they start getting proper credit. Leicester and Palace kept them under the radar.

good partnership at the moment* a top partnership is sturridge and suarez, dwight york and andy cole. I don't know if you realize but it couldn't of gone much worse today, so to entirely write off and dismiss liverpool's chances against leicester really is amazing. Even klopp said in the post match interview, liverpool could of scored 2 with a bit of luck (better judgement in the final 3rd) in the second half which would have levelled the game. This forum really is enlightenment for me, I didn't realize there was more negative fans out there than myself. Yeah I agree, the january transfer window isn't ideal, but at least 1 new player could make a difference by lifting the team. There is no point in getting to wembley unless we're going to win it, if we're not doing well in the league I doubt we'll win silverware full stop. As our form dipped last year, after an unbeaten run of 13 games, which resulted in us missing out on top 4 and were easily pushed aside in the fa cup semi by villa.

 

[Super_horns]

We haven't lost a game when going in front so clearly its the key!

Credit to Klopp for not making too much of the 1st goal (or the Liverpool players)

Must admit I was surprised Ibe and Benteke didn't come on earlier..bit of pace and physical power which is what Arsenal had when they beat us with 3 goals fairly late on.

I suppose Ighalo will attract interest and he certainly knows how to get a goal or two but hopefully we won't find the need to sell him!

That's already 2 more points than I expected from the Christmas fixtures (Chelsea/Spurs/Man City to come)

 

[thespus]

I'd rather Ighalo at Arsenal than Sturridge.

 

[Super_horns]

I'd rather Ighalo at Arsenal than Sturridge.

Well I cannot remember a time when Ighalo has even been doubtful for a game - and that goes for the team generally which has helped.

He did score a few goals for Granada in La Liga if I remember rightly (the club the Pozzos owned)

You have more than enough injury "prone" players...

 

[smat]

Gonna be a while before the next ESPN thinkpiece about how Liverpool can win the league.

 

[G-Dragon]

There are Liverpool fans who bang on about Sakho being better than Koscielny.

Well koscielny certainly showed how good he was against Westham and WBA.

No-one seems to be batting an eyelid at the fact Watford are just about to drop 20m euros on Iturbe either. Leicester could genuinely go out and prise some top players from France, Germany and Italy if they wanted to in January and consolidate a push for top 4.

It's horribly exposed just how bad the scouting strategies of the likes of Man Utd and Liverpool must be as well.

What about arsenal, chelsea, city etc? Where are their mahrez, vardy and ighalo? None of these players will be scoring at this rate or even half next season.

 

[RavenBish]

What about arsenal, chelsea, city etc? Where are their mahrez, vardy and ighalo? None of these players will be scoring at this rate or even half next season.

That's based on what exactly? Just because they're scoring at an unsustainable rate at the moment doesn't mean they'll turn to shit at some point. It just means they'll go through a patch(es) where they score less.

Didn't realise pointing out that Liverpool's transfer dealings being utterly wank was such a controversial point. Yours and Man Utd's more than the other 3 clubs you mentioned certainly.

 

[Pagnell]

An utterly shite result. I had a completely manic weekend and didn't manage to watch it. I didn't even have time to go online to take the piss out of Everton and United on Saturday, luckily after yesterday's result. And it is only made slightly better by those two losing a well. What a wasted fucking opportunity.

 

[johnnytodd]

An utterly shite result. I had a completely manic weekend and didn't manage to watch it. I didn't even have time to go online to take the piss out of Everton and United on Saturday, luckily after yesterday's result. And it is only made slightly better by those two losing a well. What a wasted fucking opportunity.

yeah yeah busy my arse

 

[G-Dragon]

That's based on what exactly? Just because they're scoring at an unsustainable rate at the moment doesn't mean they'll turn to shit at some point. It just means they'll go through a patch(es) where they score less.
Didn't realise pointing out that Liverpool's transfer dealings being utterly wank was such a controversial point. Yours and Man Utd's more than the other 3 clubs you mentioned certainly.

What controversy? Anyway, just because they are having ONE good season (scoring at "unsustainable rate") does not mean it shows teams like United, Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea etc have bad scouting strategies. Sure, they have failed in transfer markets over the years (buying exactly these kind of overrated one season wonder players, especially in Liverpool's case) but so have teams like Leicester. Bigger clubs can't afford to buy the likes of Mahrez and Vardy who, last season, scored 4 and 5 goals respectively. No club in the world would have bought these two players instead of Martial, Benteke or Firmino based on previous seasons. Remember Michu?

 

[RavenBish]

You've missed the point rather spectacularly here.

 

[G.B]

yeah, he does that

 

[thespus]

You've missed the point rather spectacularly here.

Can something someone habitually does be spectacular?

Edit - G.B.

For what it's worth, I think it would be mad for a big club sign Vardy. Mahrez, however, is a superb footballer - he'd be Liverpool's best player.

 

[JimJams]

I don't see why it'd be mad. It'd be a risk, but not like some sort of batshit crazy signing.
On Vardy I don't think it's in anyone's interest for him to leave anyway, he's at a club where he can play to his strengths which will be vital if he wants to get a spot in the England side in the Summer, he's 29, so for a buying club they're not getting too many years out of him, and then there's always the fact that he's likely to cost any prospective buyer a small fortune, as we wouldn't need the money. His price on the market would need to reflect that he's basically, in many peoples eyes, our only way into the CL spaces. So not only would the club want to be compensated for him as a player, but also compensated for the notion that we'd effectively be selling our chance of CL football. And who the fuck is going to want to pay that? Nobody. So that's that sorted.
If the club were willing to let him go for £20-25mill then I'd be very dubious if I were a buyer that there wasn't something wrong with him physically that's going to show up down the line, like he's got dodgy ankles made of wafer and we've been stapling him up before every match and now we've ran out of places to stick them. But saying this, I don't think Man City for example, would be crazy to sign him if they could get him as Aguero cover. They're quite light up front, and he could definitely do a good job for them in my eyes.
On Mahrez, he's said he's leaving his future til the summer when there'll undoubtedly be a fuckload of interested parties. Barca has been touted already but that's paper talk really, he doesn't fit. Bayern though, would be a nice switch. Robben will be dead soon and along with Ribery that pairing will be rotting away and Mahrez could work the wide positions with Costa. I think that'd be a good fit for him. PSG?
I don't think Mahrez would go to Liverpool because it's not a step up enough compared to what he can get. Now I know people will baulk at that, but Leicester look like finishing above Liverpool this season, and even if they don't, there's not going to be a huge amount in it. So you'd imagine that somebody else more desirable and higher up the table here or someone abroad would make him a more attractive offer.
There's a lot of the season to go, so if his form drops off, interest may wane. If not though, then he's not going to Liverpool.

 

[merseyboyred]

Watford were good value for that, well deserved.

We were atrocious, was out Saturday night with United & Everton mates, knew I should've held off on taking the piss!

There are Liverpool fans who bang on about Sakho being better than Koscielny.

Not that I'm commenting on quality here, but I'm pretty certain I've seen Koscielny have a terrible game from time to time! And if we let Arsenal fans have it all their own way Koscielny would be winning Sky Sports polls ahead of Baresi & Bobby Moore... #ssnhqkoscielny

He was shite yesterday but I'm more willing to give Sakho leeway than some others considering it was his first game back after 6 weeks out when he's got Bogdan in goal & had Lucas next to him for over half the game, and Skrtel otherwise, a recipe for disaster with forwards who press as well as Deeney & Ighalo. When fit his performances generally range from good to excellent, so I compare that to guys who have proven to be not good enough for a long time and I know what the weak links are!

Skrtel is the consistent bastion of wankness in our defence, but weirdly seems to escape mainstream criticism. I guess it's because he looks the part, he certainly doesn't fucking play it. His most commended two seasons were 14/15 - he scored enough goals to mask him being just as much at fault individually for our leaky defence as Johnson, & 11/12 - a season in which Dalglish got sacked & we finished 8th.

 

[JimJams]

Is the criticism of Bogdan really all that fair? He dropped the cross, but recovered it and had it kicked out of his hands, the goal shouldn't have stood. He's getting a lot of shit given he was on the wrong end of a refereeing error rather than his own mistake.

 

[thespus]

On Mahrez, he's said he's leaving his future til the summer when there'll undoubtedly be a fuckload of interested parties. Barca has been touted already but that's paper talk really, he doesn't fit. Bayern though, would be a nice switch. Robben will be dead soon and along with Ribery that pairing will be rotting away and Mahrez could work the wide positions with Costa. I think that'd be a good fit for him. PSG?
I don't think Mahrez would go to Liverpool because it's not a step up enough compared to what he can get. Now I know people will baulk at that, but Leicester look like finishing above Liverpool this season, and even if they don't, there's not going to be a huge amount in it. So you'd imagine that somebody else more desirable and higher up the table here or someone abroad would make him a more attractive offer.
There's a lot of the season to go, so if his form drops off, interest may wane. If not though, then he's not going to Liverpool.

I agree Mahrez isn't going to Liverpool, there will be bigger suitors, I was just pointing out to G-Dragon that they'd be foolish to turn their nose to him. Bayern is a good shout.

Not that I'm commenting on quality here, but I'm pretty certain I've seen Koscielny have a terrible game from time to time! And if we let Arsenal fans have it all their own way Koscielny would be winning Sky Sports polls ahead of Baresi & Bobby Moore... #ssnhqkoscielny

Koscielny has had terrible games, but he's also been a constant in a defense that has routinely been better than its Liverpool counterpart. I rate Sakho, and won't stop just because he played like a mix of Lovren and Phil Jones this weekend, Cygan incarnate if you will, but labeling him an upgrade on Koscielny is ludicrous - he's slower, worse on the ball, and doesn't read the game as well. It's tough to see where the upgrade is.