Welcome back Millers

[MagpieBee]

Not doubting you MB but....

Brentford
Company name: Brentford FC Ltd
Owned by: Matthew Benham, a betting industry tycoon and owner of Danish side FC Midtjylland
Staff costs: £17.6m

Bristol City
Company name: Bristol City Holdings
Owned by: Pula Sport, owned by billionaire and Hargreaves Lansdown co-founder Steve Lansdown
Staff costs: £17.4m

This was for 2016/17 though. It's not a criticism BTW, just a realistic expectation for the Millers. Ours has, with the much higher revenues, shot up to over £20M this year, still small fry in comparison to many in this division.

The source I was going off from the club accounts shows £14.5m for us (which is correct) and £20m for you guys

But if your £17m figure is correct for you guys, we are a lot closer than I thought

 

[Ciderup]

The source I was going off from the club accounts shows £14.5m for us (which is correct) and £20m for you guys

But if your £17m figure is correct for you guys, we are a lot closer than I thought

Maybe the £20M and £14.5M are this year MB? Ours is rumoured to be around that figure for the season just finished.

 

[MagpieBee]

Maybe the £20M and £14.5M are this year MB? Ours is rumoured to be around that figure for the season just finished.

Nope, was quoting the year when Newcastle were in the league, Wigan, etc

Might have their info wrong, well researched website though that quoted all the company accounts

 

[MillerWhale]

If Brentford are sustainable on a budget that size then fair play as their crowds are identical to ours (since they were in the Champ, ours were bigger before they got there).

It’s a decent model. It works for them s it’s meaning they’re very cool competitive e en against teams that dwarf their budget.

I like Brentford and it’s a good trip.

 

[SF_]

Don't Brentford have quite a rich owner to fall back on? They pushed the boat out to get promoted didn't they?

 

[DannyRovers]

They also have the draw of being near London.

What are you going to tell prospective players when they come up for a look at Rotherham, “er well Mr Playerello Brentford may be located nice and close to London but...well we are situated right next to...erm...Sheffield? You didn’t happen to watch any snooker when you were raised on the streets of Brazil did ya?”

 

[Ramblins]

We could always show him the sun setting behind the sewage works or some of our other local attractions like boarded up shops and watching beggars scream abuse at passers by for pretending not to notice them.

 

[Aaron-Bcfc]

Nope, was quoting the year when Newcastle were in the league, Wigan, etc

Might have their info wrong, well researched website though that quoted all the company accounts

From the accounts themselves:

Us:

Brentford:

 

[MagpieBee]

From the accounts themselves:

Us:
View attachment 8577

Brentford:
View attachment 8578

So we’re £14.5m and you guys are £18m, the guy I quoted isn’t that far off?

 

[MagpieBee]

If Brentford are sustainable on a budget that size then fair play as their crowds are identical to ours (since they were in the Champ, ours were bigger before they got there).

It’s a decent model. It works for them s it’s meaning they’re very cool competitive e en against teams that dwarf their budget.

I like Brentford and it’s a good trip.

Half our income is profit on player sales. We’ve been relatively stable finance wise the last 30 months or so (as in breaking even) but if we didn’t sell a player for £10-15m for 12 months or so we’d have to rely on the owner again. Thankfully we’ve had Hogan, Gray, Jota, Tarkowski, among others who have made decent cash over the past 2-3 years.

The plan is to break even, the owner steps in if the plan doesn’t work for a year. We haven’t and won’t push the boat out to get promoted. The intention isn’t to “bankroll” us, and our budget being bottom 4/5 every year shows that, but he does step in when things go wrong. He is also financing the whole new stadium though which is an immeasurable help

Crowds mean very little even in the Championship. The big differentiator is corporate facilities, and the ability to do business year round. Obviously having 3X the attendance is a big advantage but there are some clubs pulling in big crowds that don’t get much revenue

 

[Ciderup]

What's the Millers spend in comparison? £15M / £20M is relatively low in this league. It shows how hard it is to survive post promotion to be fair.

 

[Ramblins]

What's the Millers spend in comparison? £15M / £20M is relatively low in this league. It shows how hard it is to survive post promotion to be fair.

I'm not sure, but we have a £5,000 per week wage cap so I'm guessing it's probably £9/10 million.

Not always about the money though is it, Huddersfield and Burnley have proved that as did Sunderland with the opposite effect last season

 

[SF_]

We haven’t and won’t push the boat out to get promoted.

I was talking about League One, not the Championship when I said that. I've no idea though, remember you having some good loans but don't know about transfer fees and wage bill.

I remember Huddersfield had a massive wage bill for that level and I think some of their spending under Wagner is ignored a little. Their chairman backed them really well, especially considering they were charging very little for season tickets at the time. Another club that benefited from big player sales though.

 

[MagpieBee]

I'm not sure, but we have a £5,000 per week wage cap so I'm guessing it's probably £9/10 million.

Not always about the money though is it, Huddersfield and Burnley have proved that as did Sunderland with the opposite effect last season

Yeah, you guys were around the £9m mark IIRC when you were last here. Burton around £7m.

Either way, anyone who looks reasonably safe off a budget of £20m or less is doing a cracking job.

 

[MagpieBee]

I was talking about League One, not the Championship when I said that. I've no idea though, remember you having some good loans but don't know about transfer fees and wage bill.

I remember Huddersfield had a massive wage bill for that level and I think some of their spending under Wagner is ignored a little. Their chairman backed them really well, especially considering they were charging very little for season tickets at the time. Another club that benefited from big player sales though.

Ah - yeah to be fair there we did have a pretty sizeable budget when back in League 1, and overall the owner has put in about £100m now (through buying the club, guaranteeing debt, subsiding the playing squad, paying for the new stadium, etc) so while we are doing very well on a tiny budget compared to other teams, we’re also completely still reliant on our owner.

 

[Brad-Owl]

I'm not sure, but we have a £5,000 per week wage cap so I'm guessing it's probably £9/10 million.

Not always about the money though is it, Huddersfield and Burnley have proved that as did Sunderland with the opposite effect last season

And to think John Terry was reported to be on £80k a week at Villa.

That's more than your entire starting 11.

 

[Reaper]

I'm not sure, but we have a £5,000 per week wage cap so I'm guessing it's probably £9/10 million.

Not always about the money though is it, Huddersfield and Burnley have proved that as did Sunderland with the opposite effect last season

I'm sure we were paying players like Halford, Blackstock and Odemwingie close to 10k last time in championship, are you sure we're on a 5k wage cap?

 

[Ramblins]

I'm sure we were paying players like Halford, Blackstock and Odemwingie close to 10k last time in championship, are you sure we're on a 5k wage cap?

No not sure at all, just what I read in the media. None of us are privy to that information except for the manager, chairman and the players involved.

 

[SoutheySWFC]

10m on wages including all staff im last accounts but a staggering 88 first team and youth team players and coaches, scary.

 

[SMH]

Apparently the average wage now for a Championship player is 16k a week. We can thank the likes of Derby, Sheff Wed, Villa, Birmingham along with any Premier League team who gets relegated for that. Brentford have done as well as they have for years as their recruitment since promotion has been top draw and netted millions in transfer fees. Gray, Hogan, Jota etc all sold for huge profit. Didn’t they also shut their academy to save money?

 

[MillerWhale]

Rochdale do the same in the lower leagues, but eventually your saleable assets dry up and then you’re fighting an uphill battle.

I think the longer term prospects for teams like us, Millwall, Brentford, Preston are pretty grim. It’s getting harder and harder for teams without Premiership ambition to compete in this league. It really is Premiership 2 but we’ll do our best as ever.

 

[SoutheySWFC]

Apparently the average wage now for a Championship player is 16k a week. We can thank the likes of Derby, Sheff Wed, Villa, Birmingham along with any Premier League team who gets relegated for that. Brentford have done as well as they have for years as their recruitment since promotion has been top draw and netted millions in transfer fees. Gray, Hogan, Jota etc all sold for huge profit. Didn’t they also shut their academy to save money?

From 2000 (prem relegation) to 2015 we didn't have a pot to piss in, clubs were pushing wages up well before we jumped in. I forget Wigan rose up the leagues on ha'pennies and love.

 

[markwwfc1992]

It's true, I remember Sheffield Wednesday coming to Molineux with players like Luke Boden and Richard Hinds...

 

[MagpieBee]

Apparently the average wage now for a Championship player is 16k a week. We can thank the likes of Derby, Sheff Wed, Villa, Birmingham along with any Premier League team who gets relegated for that. Brentford have done as well as they have for years as their recruitment since promotion has been top draw and netted millions in transfer fees. Gray, Hogan, Jota etc all sold for huge profit. Didn’t they also shut their academy to save money?

That was partly that we weren’t getting a good return, too few players came through, then the EPP or whatever it’s called came in, and meant that any decent players we could develop could be taken from us for peanuts.

We now run a B Team instead, which is less expensive (as you only need one team, not one for each age group) and isn’t subject to academy rules.

Seems to be working ok so far, had a lot more players come through that system in the last 2-3 years than we had in the 5-10 years before then with the academy.

But, shutting the academy was pretty harsh on the local community, lots of kids dropped pretty suddenly, and a lot of job losses. Had to be done though to try and compete in this league.

Other clubs will wise up over time to the way we do things, for now though we’re pretty comfortable.

 

[SoutheySWFC]

That was partly that we weren’t getting a good return, too few players came through, then the EPP or whatever it’s called came in, and meant that any decent players we could develop could be taken from us for peanuts.

We now run a B Team instead, which is less expensive (as you only need one team, not one for each age group) and isn’t subject to academy rules.

Seems to be working ok so far, had a lot more players come through that system in the last 2-3 years than we had in the 5-10 years before then with the academy.

But, shutting the academy was pretty harsh on the local community, lots of kids dropped pretty suddenly, and a lot of job losses. Had to be done though to try and compete in this league.

Other clubs will wise up over time to the way we do things, for now though we’re pretty comfortable.

It's crackers, absolute bollocks EFPP is a forced rule allowing the big boys to cherry pick from anywhere at minimal cost, if we didn't accept the tv deal was reduced.

They harvest all the top talent and given you can only pick 11 players on a pitch they get lost in the ether as the CL/PL is coveted so a 40m 26 year old from Croatia is more likely to be played than Dan 19 from Acton.

Chelsea have 60 odd out on loan, kids playing for the national team at u21 are on 10k a week.

Despite being a founder member club and yearning to get back the Premier League is vulgar.

Meh

 

[MagpieBee]

It's crackers, absolute bollocks EFPP is a forced rule allowing the big boys to cherry pick from anywhere at minimal cost, if we didn't accept the tv deal was reduced.

They harvest all the top talent and given you can only pick 11 players on a pitch they get lost in the ether as the CL/PL is coveted so a 40m 26 year old from Croatia is more likely to be played than Dan 19 from Acton.

Chelsea have 60 odd out on loan, kids playing for the national team at u21 are on 10k a week.

Despite being a founder member club and yearning to get back the Premier League is vulgar.

Meh

Agree. EFPP should be scrapped, and there should be limits on the number of players a club can have over a certain age boundary. Would solve a lot of the problems. Will never happen though.

 

[Millerbri]

They also have the draw of being near London.

What are you going to tell prospective players when they come up for a look at Rotherham, “er well Mr Playerello Brentford may be located nice and close to London but...well we are situated right next to...erm...Sheffield? You didn’t happen to watch any snooker when you were raised on the streets of Brazil did ya?”

Yes but it's a quite a nice problem to have, wouldn't you agree.
Maybe they will live near Warney in Bawtry and trek into our wasteland every day for training.

 

[SF_]

Rochdale do the same in the lower leagues, but eventually your saleable assets dry up and then you’re fighting an uphill battle.

I think the longer term prospects for teams like us, Millwall, Brentford, Preston are pretty grim. It’s getting harder and harder for teams without Premiership ambition to compete in this league. It really is Premiership 2 but we’ll do our best as ever.

Not sure I agree about the not having ambition to reach the Premier League. Harder to achieve but getting in the top 6 is the aim for us, Brentford and Millwall.

 

[MillerWhale]

Well add us to your list then. Why not? If Blackpool, Wigan and Bournemouth can do it, there’s hope for us all.

 

[Ciderup]

Not sure I agree about the not having ambition to reach the Premier League. Harder to achieve but getting in the top 6 is the aim for us, Brentford and Millwall.

'Cough' us too!