Luton Town Relocation Plans

[Maple Hatter]

Luton seem to have been fighting for years with local opposition. Are this company bosses on drugs! The area behind the mall is awful and attracts undesireables worse than football fans. Imagine if luton got new ground, attendances would double and im sure alot of those fans would pop in mall before of after games. The tescos and marks and spencers would shift a few sandwhichs for sure. He should see how busy newcastle is on matchdays where local firms embrace footie fans even mcdonalds have offers on for st holders

We've been trying to move for 60 years. The club's planning application is about as detailed as you can get to ensure we cover any potential objections. The problem with any new stadium is you will always get objections. I think its safe to say that this particular company are blinkered in their approach and see our plans as threat rather than a potential boost to their own business. Their arguments just show how out of touch they are with the local community.
It's frustrating to say the least that we have to face yet another uphill struggle to what in my opinion is our last chance to make sure our club survives in the modern game. KR for all its charm is a stadium which should have been demolished a long time ago.

 

[Maple Hatter]

Have those plans by And been 100% confirmed as going ahead? It does look like a decent stadium, but it will be sad to lose Kennilworth Road. Definitely hope I get there again. However, at least this probably won't be a terrible flat pack jobby.

I'm sure I read somewhere that Grimsby were also looking to relocate. Quite a similar need to our own I guess. A club in an ageing stadium who need to move to be able to realise their potential. Any news?

 

[Son of Cod]

I'm sure I read somewhere that Grimsby were also looking to relocate. Quite a similar need to our own I guess. A club in an ageing stadium who need to move to be able to realise their potential. Any news?

Yes, we've also been trying to move for ages and put a fair bit of time and money into various plans/submissions. The initially proposed site was met with opposition from the resident, council and vole communities.
The latest developers have been "given the green light to go ahead with the next stage of their planning" (or something along those lines). I assume that that means the developers/architects are okay to start sourcing potential engineers and sub contractors and begin working on planning stage drawings. One snag that seems to have been overcome, but that I think might resurface, is that the developers don't have stadium planning experience and it is an ambitious project. £250m stadium, training facilities, ice rink, residential properties, retail units, etc. I wish we'd go down your route and spend more on reputable developers/architects than an all signing all dancing complex. Granted, a huge point of a new stadium is to generate revenue but a place with a bit of character is also important. Which is something I think you lot will have with And.

 

[Maple Hatter]

Yes, we've also been trying to move for ages and put a fair bit of time and money into various plans/submissions. The initially proposed site was met with opposition from the resident, council and vole communities.
The latest developers have been "given the green light to go ahead with the next stage of their planning" (or something along those lines). I assume that that means the developers/architects are okay to start sourcing potential engineers and sub contractors and begin working on planning stage drawings. One snag that seems to have been overcome, but that I think might resurface, is that the developers don't have stadium planning experience and it is an ambitious project. £250m stadium, training facilities, ice rink, residential properties, retail units, etc. I wish we'd go down your route and spend more on reputable developers/architects than an all signing all dancing complex. Granted, a huge point of a new stadium is to generate revenue but a place with a bit of character is also important. Which is something I think you lot will have with And.

Its important to get the right people on board even if it does cost more money. That's something we've learnt from our previous failed attempts to relocate. The other positive from the Power Court application is getting the community involved and the fans who have voiced their opinions on the design, mostly that it will generate an atmosphere and will not resemble one of the modern day soulless bowls. Probably also helps that our board members are also fans themselves and not just investors.
Your project does sound ambitious but the revenue aspect is essential. Sounds like you have an awful lot of work ahead you. I wish you luck.

 

[BelizeHatter]

.......that and incorporating a Formula 1 track in your designs

 

[Kenneth E End]

So, 22nd June 2017. We're still waiting for someone to make a decision... the application being validated nearly 10 months ago now, with the statutory decision period typically 13 weeks. I wonder if this is now going to push back our timeline if being in the stadium for the 2020-21 season (3 years from now).

There is increasing pressure on C&R the only objector - the boss is attending a supporters meeting this week.

Although from a financial standpoint, we need to leave Kenilworth Road to "make a profit", we could actually be breaking even in the next few years prior to moving across to Power Court, according to Gary Sweet, however we're still racking up six-figure losses which is underwritten by our shareholders. The club has probably never broken even in its modern history. The club however has probably never been healthier and thus in the transfer market, probably as strong as ever.

I see that the latest accounts for 2020 Developments has been filed for the period prior to the club purchasing Power Court - the land at Newlands Park being worth £10.4m. So that's an indicator of how much investment is involved at the club, albeit much of that mortgaged.

 

[Impish]

Probably needs a big green dome on to get the go ahead sadly

 

[That Fat Centre Half]

Fair play to this Ken Ford bloke for C&R who came to a meeting about the stadium involving both local MPs, the local council and the supporters club. By all accounts took an absolute onslaught from all comers and his arguments against the proposal look frankly ludicrous in the cold light of day (apparently didnt even know that we now all the land at Power Court! And thinks that a few more entrances to the Mall will make a whole world of difference) but at least he had the balls to show up and take his hiding. Reading the live tweets of the meeting he really took a pasting! Hopefully he now reconsiders his view on the strength of feeling shown but i doubt it.

I find it absolutely ridiculous that a private organisation, that has done pretty much nothing to improve things in the town and owns an eyesore, who don't even own the land can hold up this proposal, which has pretty much universal support from local people, local government and both local representatives in Parliament, seemingly on the basis (wrongly in my view as well as actually) that they are worried it will impact their profit margins. Surely that should come a very distant 3rd to what local people want and the good of the town.

Still it seems we are inching closer to getting things done, and to have the support of all those really is amazing and a testament to Gary Sweets networking skills!

 

[Kenneth E End]

He can still slow the progress of it down, as he already has done so. If he didn't oppose, I dare say the first few bricks may have already been laid.

"GS reveals that KF threatened club in a meeting. To 'kick them into the long grass and take the club through the courts for years to come.'"

 

[Maple Hatter]

He can still slow the progress of it down, as he already has done so. If he didn't oppose, I dare say the first few bricks may have already been laid.

"GS reveals that KF threatened club in a meeting. To 'kick them into the long grass and take the club through the courts for years to come.'"

I really don't understand why Ken Ford is stubbornly pursuing his delaying tactics. His company will not get their hands on Power Court and our club will not give up its fight to build a new stadium in that location. Hopefully his attendance at the recent meeting and the reception he received wil make him think again. The other puzzling issue for me is that our council are allowing these delaying tactics which doesn't help the club or the town. The whole episode is very frustrating and a strong reminder of the problems we have faced in the past, this despite the club putting forward a very professional case and bending over backwards to satisfy all parties.

 

[That Fat Centre Half]

Don't think it's a case of the council "allowing" anything. They have to follow the process and the planning rules, otherwise they leave themselves open to all sorts of accusations and god knows what else. It's just unfortunate that the one objector has the means and the determination to be able to exploit every single delaying tactic available. Think it's very very harsh to be pointing fingers in the councils direction.

 

[Kenneth E End]

The council though can do one thing.... get on with it and make a bloody decision.

 

[Maple Hatter]

Don't think it's a case of the council "allowing" anything. They have to follow the process and the planning rules, otherwise they leave themselves open to all sorts of accusations and god knows what else. It's just unfortunate that the one objector has the means and the determination to be able to exploit every single delaying tactic available. Think it's very very harsh to be pointing fingers in the councils direction.

I don't share your patience with the council. 60 years trying to move and the council claim to have our interests at heart. I'm sorry but there are plenty of other clubs around the country that have received a lot more help and support from their local authority. As I've stated before our club has done everything that is required to inform and reassure all parties in the planning application and at great cost. How long is this going to drag on. At the moment I see no signs of any progress just a stalemate which in times could damage our own plans. Politics whether it be at local or national level is all about making the right noises. I've heard it all before and yet we still wait.

 

[That Fat Centre Half]

Fair point but still think it's a bit harsh to beat the current people in the council with that stick. It's different people involved now who have seemingly been very helpful to our cause of late. They are doing things by the book which is what we want to avoid complications and challenges further down the line.

If you read the comments of the councillor who attended the meeting they were very positive and stating that we were 9/10ths of the way there (or some words to that affect) so not really a stalemate.

 

[Kenneth E End]

Fair point but still think it's a bit harsh to beat the current people in the council with that stick. It's different people involved now who have seemingly been very helpful to our cause of late. They are doing things by the book which is what we want to avoid complications and challenges further down the line.

If you read the comments of the councillor who attended the meeting they were very positive and stating that we were 9/10ths of the way there (or some words to that affect) so not really a stalemate.

Agreed. And lets be honest, what have the club themselves in the past actually produced as plans? The Kohler Dome: always going to be difficult to pass, a stadium with an F1 track and a stadium not actually in Luton. Previous (crook) owners haven't engaged in the ways required - its a two way street.

I actually think the Deputy Leader of the Council has gone a bit too far - the council have to be seen to be as impartial as possible and as watertight as a mermaid's brassiere. Any slip and it leads to the courts.

Now looking at September/October at a decision.

 

[Kenneth E End]

Bump. Blimey this thread was started 30 months ago now and no posts in 5. Think it sums up recent progress.

That said, there does seem to be a slither of momentum building up again. There has been a bit of frustration from fans, myself included, that the decision 'date' keeps getting put back and there is still no firm drop-dead date that the council seem to be working towards. Capital & Regional, owners of The Mall, are supposedly in the background, putting up legal blocks and challenges; doing everything they can to slow the process down. The club and council now believe that this process is now coming to a close.

Personally I don't understand how any sort of legal challenge affects the ability to provide planning permission for a scheme that has nothing to do with them.

Tonight the Local Plan through to 2030 has been adopted in its revised format, which removes the hurdle of Newlands Park being earmarked for a stadium. This is a major breakthrough and allows the council to provide permission for Power Court with a degree of confidence that this wouldn't be used as a stick in a court.

The site itself is now providing additional shoppers parking, undercutting Mall parking, as well as providing more spaces for fans on matchday.

 

[Bosox]

There were always going to be delays like this, I said in my first post in this thread that 2020's stated dates for getting approval were not going to be met.

The dates Sweet gave for the planning process look wildly optimistic though, even with Council support. He said they hoped to submit the application this summer and get the final ok by Jan 1 2017. I can't see any way that process for both sites can be done that quickly, you just know that some local NIMBYs will want to pursue every single avenue and drag it through the courts.

The good news is that nothing so far seems insurmountable, it's just a case of letting the process play out and accepting that it will take longer than any of us want.

 

[Maple Hatter]

There were always going to be delays like this, I said in my first post in this thread that 2020's stated dates for getting approval were not going to be met.

I don't think any Luton fan believed the orignal dates were going to be met. We know all too well from experience that delays would be inevitable.The revised local plan is a step forward but we still have to deal with C&R and their ridiculous objections. Its a pity the local plan didn't include the demolition of the Mall. I think most Lutonian would agree that the character of the town was ruined the moment that was built. Anyway when the victory comes it will be our finest.

 

[Kenneth E End]

I don't think any Luton fan believed the orignal dates were going to be met. We know all too well from experience that delays would be inevitable.The revised local plan is a step forward but we still have to deal with C&R and their ridiculous objections. Its a pity the local plan didn't include the demolition of the Mall. I think most Lutonian would agree that the character of the town was ruined the moment that was built. Anyway when the victory comes it will be our finest.

I agree the original 2020 opening date was optimistic, but it was doable based on the original timeline. I guess everything now is being put back 1 year, so June 2021 I suppose is moving day.

 

[Kenneth E End]

So first update in this thread in over three months says a lot - there is very little to update and frankly, it is getting ridiculous.

Gary Sweet had a shot at the council in the programme last night for not yet making a decision 20 months on, but are now in the final throes of the process. He also said that we would need a decision before MIPIM in Cannes, a prestigious property conference, which starts on the 13th March (no doubt they want to start securing contractors), otherwise it would cost us substantially more.

Firmly puts the ball in the councils court.

 

[That Fat Centre Half]

First time Sweet has come out and said something to show frustration in this whole process. I agree with him though it is ridiculous now, what on earth are they doing that takes this long? I know it’s a relatively complicated project but still.

Not one to bash public services as I know they are terribly stretched but there must be mass inefficiency in the LBC planning department.

 

[Kenneth E End]

First time Sweet has come out and said something to show frustration in this whole process. I agree with him though it is ridiculous now, what on earth are they doing that takes this long? I know it’s a relatively complicated project but still.

Not one to bash public services as I know they are terribly stretched but there must be mass inefficiency in the LBC planning department.

It takes less time to decide Olympic bids.

 

[rudebwoyben]

It takes less time to decide Olympic bids.

Looking at the example of the Rio Olympics, I don't think that's really a good comparison to make!

 

[Maple Hatter]

The council have never impressed me regarding their dealings with our club. They claim to have the best interests of the club at heart yet their incompetence is there to be seen. The club on the other hand have helped the council hugely in building up local relations and getting involved in other issues relating to the town. Our planning application couldn't be more professional. Every issue has been gone through with a fine tooth comb. I'm sure the delay is not only down to C&Rs tactics. Our council is being far too cautious regarding this application. Far more so than any other major projects affecting the town. Well done GS for his comments. I sense however these are relativley tame compared to what he thinks privately. The fans are equally frustrated, angry even at these delays. If ever a town needed a facelift its Luton. I fear however the council are quite content to plod along at snails pace all glossed over by a future plan which looks great on paper but in reality will never happen. More poundlands and more runways seem to be the councils priority. Useless c*nts!!

 

[Luke Imp]

We're in a similar waiting game for ours and revolves around getting permission to build a bridge and purpose built exit road towards the bypass, which could take 3 years or so to get the 'ok' on. Only then can we push forward quicker.

Our Board are still aiming for 5 years, but 5 will become 6, 6 equals 7 etc etc although it'll eventually get done IMO.

Luckily, the Council are on board because it's part of a sports village come new housing development area and won't be fully completed until 2030 (off the top of my head) but the Stadium will be built first.

 

[Kenneth E End]

The council have never impressed me regarding their dealings with our club. They claim to have the best interests of the club at heart yet their incompetence is there to be seen. The club on the other hand have helped the council hugely in building up local relations and getting involved in other issues relating to the town. Our planning application couldn't be more professional. Every issue has been gone through with a fine tooth comb. I'm sure the delay is not only down to C&Rs tactics. Our council is being far too cautious regarding this application. Far more so than any other major projects affecting the town. Well done GS for his comments. I sense however these are relativley tame compared to what he thinks privately. The fans are equally frustrated, angry even at these delays. If ever a town needed a facelift its Luton. I fear however the council are quite content to plod along at snails pace all glossed over by a future plan which looks great on paper but in reality will never happen. More poundlands and more runways seem to be the councils priority. Useless c*nts!!

Its amazing how quick the council gave planning permission to the airport expansion, something that has vastly more impacts - a site which it owns! To be fair, it keeps my council tax bill lower than what it could be.

This project and everything else going on the town regeneration wise is the only thing keeping me here. Family and friends have since moved away. I travel either back and forth to London, which is a lengthy and tiring commute and when I'm not doing that I'm working abroad. The council are not doing enough to keep young(ish) professionals in the town.

C&R seem to have gone fiendishly quiet in the last few months since Ken Ford moved on - strangely we've heard nothing more of their own expansion and stadium plans. Funny that! They have no ambition to do such a thing - they want a total monopoly. They're scared that someone might actually come and do a better job. All they're interested in is pound shops and takeaways.

 

[Kenneth E End]

So an update last night from LBC. They expect to be able to announce a date for the special planning meeting at the end of April, thus missing the March deadline. So an announcement about an announcement. It’ll probably be after the end of the season it’ll get resolved.

You know what will happen - they will announce it the day before an open top bus parade and then take all the freebies and hospitality like they always do at such an event.

 

[Maple Hatter]

So an update last night from LBC. They expect to be able to announce a date for the special planning meeting at the end of April, thus missing the March deadline. So an announcement about an announcement. It’ll probably be after the end of the season it’ll get resolved.

You know what will happen - they will announce it the day before an open top bus parade and then take all the freebies and hospitality like they always do at such an event.

This latest response is nothing more than I expect from a useless pile of unprofessional fools. I left the town many years ago for the very reason that it doesn't offer me any future. In fact the town has been on a downward spiral for many years despite the potential for massive growth thanks to its geographical location, excellent infrastructure and at one time ability to attract investment. It seems though the people who have the power to make local decisions aren't capable of doing so. I strongly suspect there is something going on behind the scenes that is responsible for these constant delays. Politics whether it be national or local can be subject to external pressure from people or organisations that have their own agenda. I'll say no more.

 

[Kenneth E End]

This latest response is nothing more than I expect from a useless pile of unprofessional fools. I left the town many years ago for the very reason that it doesn't offer me any future. In fact the town has been on a downward spiral for many years despite the potential for massive growth thanks to its geographical location, excellent infrastructure and at one time ability to attract investment. It seems though the people who have the power to make local decisions aren't capable of doing so. I strongly suspect there is something going on behind the scenes that is responsible for these constant delays. Politics whether it be national or local can be subject to external pressure from people or organisations that have their own agenda. I'll say no more.

I'll be leaving town too if it doesn't get approved.

 

[Hatter86]

Major update. C and R, the major objectors to the stadium at Power Court have announced they have changed their stance on the stadium and are fully supportive of it. They do still say they are opposed to the enabling development at Newlands Park.

Hell of a U-Turn from them. Can only assume they have accepted they cannot won this and are trying to save some face. One major roadblock out of the way, although I’m fairly sure both developments have to happen. We can’t have Power Court without Newlands Park.

https://www.lutontoday.co.uk/news/c-r-fundamentally-changed-position-on-power-court-1-8443352