The Labour Thread

[The Paranoid Pineapple]

UKIP and Labour sources both very much suggesting that Labour have won (which isn't something which should ever have been in doubt). I hope it's a healthy majority, although reports seem mixed on this front. Turnout seemingly very low.

 

[Aber gas]

How have they gone to UKIP? Doesn't UKIP ban ex BNP members?

Obviously UKIP have some appeal to racist followers because they're the only major party serious about getting immigration down, but I think there has to be more going on for them to get a bit of a charge on in this seat.

They officially do and it's a tidy sound bite for them, but it's complete bollocks. For a start anybody who joined before the ban is still allowed to be a member. The " ban " only applies specifically to the Bnp so doesn't cover affiliated parties or movements. This was seen when Monkton ukip's leader in Scotland invited the BFP to join ukip. The BFP were formed as a breakaway party from the Bnp and took a lot of financial power and organisational skill with them.
Even I'm not saying that ukip are the same as the Bnp, but there is definitely a fair bit of crossover.

 

[The Paranoid Pineapple]

Turnout actually confirmed at over 40%. No great shakes, but fine by by-election standards and much higher than expected. Also lots of suggestions doing the rounds from party sources that Labour have actually done very well, winning the seat comfortably.

 

[Alty]

Turnout actually confirmed at over 40%. No great shakes, but fine by by-election standards and much higher than expected. Also lots of suggestions doing the rounds from party sources that Labour have actually done very well, winning the seat comfortably.

Potentially a much needed fillip for Corbs, then.

 

[blade1889]

The propaganda machine of the left marches on

Except Labour actually increased its vote share

 

[Pliny Harris]

Oldham West & Royton result:
LAB: 62.2% (+7.5)
UKIP: 23.3% (+2.7)
CON: 9.3% (-9.6)
LDEM: 3.7% (+0.0)
GRN: 0.9% (-1.0)
MRLP: 0.5% (+0.5)

Decent. Not exactly a bellweather seat but a good vindication for the current Labour leadership. Possibly its first victory this week, but with the importance of the Syria vote I've noticed the Corbyn social media presence has had a real bounce, for example with the Jeremy Corbyn for PM Facebook page hitting 100k at the start of the week and now standing at 117k.

Other than staying together in the first place, becoming the most relevant vote for the proletariat is still the big aim, definitely won't come just because you're the most likely party to improve their stock, and probably falters due to people like me using words like proletariat.

 

[Cheese & Biscuits]

Except Labour actually increased its vote share

You and your damned facts.

 

[Techno Natch]

The propaganda machine of the left marches on

Have you read the Guardian lately? They hate JC and would not have missed a chance to stick the boot in.

 

[The Paranoid Pineapple]

The reduced majority is completely meaningless as that's purely a result of lower turnout (which you would fully expect, it being a by-election rather than a GE).

 

[The Paranoid Pineapple]

Truth be told it's not the most exciting result - Labour holding a safe seat with a decent majority is probably about what you'd expect to see. Even if it had been an interesting outcome the usual caveats about by-elections - that they're unusual beasts which tell us little, if anything about the prevailing national mood - would still apply. That said, it's a result that will definitely cheer Labour, especially given all the dire predictions, and it perhaps demonstrates that Corbyn's not quite as toxic as his opponents would have us believe. I'm quite amused that the media got their predictions so very wrong, not least because it seems to have sent Farage into meltdown (again).

 

[Alty]

I actually think Farage has half a point. I think widespread fraud with postal votes probably is a reality. However, the fact is UKIP failed to convince anywhere near enough people to turn out for them. Negative campaigning against Corbyn failed. Strong local candidate for Labour too, tbf.

 

[Dave-Vale]

http://www.thecanary.co/2015/12/04/...ow-despicable-front-page-attack-corbyn-image/

I refuse to post anything directly from The Torygraph simply because it's as bad as The Sun and The Daily Mail.

The British media and their war on common sense and decency is a fucking joke.

Corbyn was out today in his own constituency singing carols and raising money for Oxfam. All whilst Cameron and his rich mates were probably sipping expensive Champagne, eating expensive food, shagging pigs and planning which country they're going to abuse next.

 

[Abertawe]

A smart mind is dangerous, they're doing the same thing to Tyson Fury.

 

[BlueBee]

http://www.thecanary.co/2015/12/04/...ow-despicable-front-page-attack-corbyn-image/

I refuse to post anything directly from The Torygraph simply because it's as bad as The Sun and The Daily Mail.

The British media and their war on common sense and decency is a fucking joke.

Corbyn was out today in his own constituency singing carols and raising money for Oxfam. All whilst Cameron and his rich mates were probably sipping expensive Champagne, eating expensive food, shagging pigs and planning which country they're going to abuse next.

Nah mate...Corbyn was at home writing a letter to get a fraudster, who stole thousands from the elderly, out of prison. A percentage of that money has been sent to Syria and isis.

After he was protesting outside Finsbury Park Mosque for peace and against anti-semitism. Beyond words this bloke. Finsbury Park mosque? Is he having a fucking laugh?

 

[Pliny Harris]

Couldn't agree more mate, tackling hatred, intolerance and medieval prison systems are terrible ideas. Why doesn't he go out and job a proper job?

 

[Ian_Wrexham]

Nah mate...Corbyn was at home writing a letter to get a fraudster, who stole thousands from the elderly, out of prison. A percentage of that money has been sent to Syria and isis.

After he was protesting outside Finsbury Park Mosque for peace and against anti-semitism. Beyond words this bloke. Finsbury Park mosque? Is he having a fucking laugh?

Finsbury Park mosque was attacked in an arson attack.

That's why there was a peace vigil.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

This convicted fraudster whom Scotland Yard had evidence to believe he was sending proceeds of his scam to help people travel from Europe to Islamic State. Corbyn gets him out on bail and his family describe Corbyn as a family friend of many years.

Although you won't find anything about the story in the Guardian funnily enough, just the press on the right... Rather unfortunate for Corbyn though as it perpetuates a certain narrative from them.

 

[Ian_Wrexham]

This convicted fraudster whom Scotland Yard had evidence to believe he was sending proceeds of his scam to help people travel from Europe to Islamic State. Corbyn gets him out on bail and his family describe Corbyn as a family friend of many years.

Although you won't find anything about the story in the Guardian funnily enough, just the press on the right... Rather unfortunate for Corbyn though as it perpetuates a certain narrative from them.

Yeah because "can you write a bail letter for a constituent to say he's local, has kids and won't abscond" isn't just a standard request MPs get asked to do.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

Being described as a "family friend of many years" probably being the slightly more unfortunate bit for Jezza considering the narrative being built, even though the reality is probably likely that he barely knows them.

 

[Alty]

Yeah because "can you write a bail letter for a constituent to say he's local, has kids and won't abscond" isn't just a standard request MPs get asked to do.

In my experience the majority of MPs ignore such requests when they relate to despicable human beings like Dahir though. It does raise questions. If Corbyn is a close friend of the family, you have to worry about the company he keeps. If he doesn't really know them, why is he using his office to get the man out? Are some of the elderly victims not constituents of Corbyn too? Is it likely they'd have wanted this bloke out on the street again?

 

[Ian_Wrexham]

In my experience the majority of MPs ignore such requests when they relate to despicable human beings like Dahir though. It does raise questions. If Corbyn is a close friend of the family, you have to worry about the company he keeps. If he doesn't really know them, why is he using his office to get the man out? Are some of the elderly victims not constituents of Corbyn too? Is it likely they'd have wanted this bloke out on the street again?

Well, the fraud was by phone so probably not. Anyway, he's not a violent criminal and didn't abscond so clearly granting him bail was the right thing to do.

 

[Dave-Vale]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35069929

It wouldn't be so bad if Jeremy would just tow the line and only attend dinners with arms dealers.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

So now Jezza has managed to upset the Falkland islanders by going on about the Falklands war, being purely a "xenophobic" election stunt and suchlike. Falklanders calling for a public apology etc.

Not entirely surprised that he feels that way though.

 

[Christian Slater]

Corbyn is one of those politicians that says what he thinks and doesn't sanitise his opinions for public opinion. It's the kind of politican I love but never gets anywhere because of that trait.

 

[Alty]

So now Jezza has managed to upset the Falkland islanders by going on about the Falklands war, being purely a "xenophobic" election stunt and suchlike. Falklanders calling for a public apology etc.

Not entirely surprised that he feels that way though.

Tbf that's not quite what he said. He seems to have been implying that the Falklands caused a wave of patriotism that tipped into xenophobia. Which might be true, to an extent.

He does keep getting into these unfortunate situations, though. He needs to improve. And quickly.

 

[Dr Mantis Toboggan]

i really worry about corbyn

 

[HertsWolf]

Tbf that's not quite what he said. He seems to have been implying that the Falklands caused a wave of patriotism that tipped into xenophobia. Which might be true, to an extent.

He does keep getting into these unfortunate situations, though. He needs to improve. And quickly.

Improve? Why?

Do you mean become more like the identikit Westminster schmoozemeister clothed, head to toe, in grey and selling access to the highest bidder?
He may have a lot of rough edges, but it's clear that a lot of people like that. True: many don't, but they aren't going to like him anyway. Outrage and utter vomit-inducing disgust shown by the elderly proprietors of the tabloids isn't necessarily a bad thing. Farage, Corbyn and Sturgeon all show that being an ordinary bloke (apologies to Ms Sturgeon) is becoming quite popular.

 

[mnb089mnb]

i really worry about corbyn

I feel sad to say it, but I think he's totally unelectable. If Labour go with him as leader into the next election, they will be annihilated.

 

[Dr Mantis Toboggan]

us and america are on a really dumb path. we've gotten so bored of wishy-washy ideologically indistinguishable suits so we've got (and they're heading towards) two parties with leaders on absolutely opposite ends of the spectrum. dunno how it got that bad. it's nice to have some ideology, but people generally muddle around in the middle of the spectrum

 

[Alty]

Improve? Why?

Do you mean become more like the identikit Westminster schmoozemeister clothed, head to toe, in grey and selling access to the highest bidder?
He may have a lot of rough edges, but it's clear that a lot of people like that. True: many don't, but they aren't going to like him anyway. Outrage and utter vomit-inducing disgust shown by the elderly proprietors of the tabloids isn't necessarily a bad thing. Farage, Corbyn and Sturgeon all show that being an ordinary bloke (apologies to Ms Sturgeon) is becoming quite popular.

I feel like you're posing a false dichotomy. It doesn't have to be PR robot on the one hand vs gobshite who never pauses for a second before thinking on the other.

Corbyn can express views with which many will disagree, and yes, even use that as a virtue as he'll be seen to be honest and straightforward. "I believe in renationalising the railways", as an example. Fine. Good.

But careless talk about the Falklands and xenophobia...he just needs to check himself and think about how stuff like that is going to be portrayed by others.

I accept a lot of the criticism he gets is unwarranted but he needs to wise up and start thinking about the impression people have of him and how he can improve the public's perceptions. Does he want to win the next election or not? Sturgeon and Farage are both much better politicians. I accept its hard for Corbyn because he never actually geared himself up for leadership, but he's got to improve pronto.