the middle east Thread

[Dr Mantis Toboggan]

the vid going around (that i posted then deleted ma bad) is an old one. it's a pretty minor warcrime in the cesspit of warcrimes that is syria too, tbf

 

[spireite]

Putin:

"This event is beyond the normal framework of fighting against terrorism. Of course our military is doing heroic work against terrorism... But the loss today is a stab in the back, carried out by the accomplices of terrorists. I can’t describe it in any other way. Our aircraft was downed over the territory of Syria, using air-to-air missile from a Turkish F-16. It fell on the Syrian territory 4km from Turkey."


"Neither our pilots nor our jet threatened the territory of Turkey. This is obvious. They are fighting terrorists in the northern areas around Latakia, where militants are located, mainly people who originated in Russia, and they were pursuing their direct duty, to make sure these people do not return to Russia. These are people who are clearly international terrorists."


"Taking into account that we signed an agreement on deconflicting with the US, and as we know Turkey was among the ones that has joined the US coalition. Since Isis has such huge resources of hundreds of millions and billions of dollars coming from illicit oil sales, and they are protected by the armed forces of other states, then it’s clear why they are so brazen, why they are killing people, why they are carrying out terrorist attacks throughout the world including in the heart of Europe."


"We will analyse everything, and today’s tragic event will have significant consequences, including for Russia-Turkish relations. We have always treated Turkey as a friendly state. I don’t know who was interested in what happened today, certainly not us. And instead of immediately getting in contact with us, as far as we know, the Turkish side immediately turned to their partners from Nato to discuss this incident, as if we shot down their plane and not they ours."


"Do they want to make Nato serve ISIS? I understand that every state has its own regional interests and we’ve always respected that, but we will never allow the kind of crime that happened to today to take place. And of course we hope that the international community will find the strength to come together and fight against the common evil."


"We have long been recording the movement of a large amount of oil and petroleum products to Turkey from Isis-occupied territories. This explains the significant funding the terrorists are receiving. Now they are stabbing us in the back by hitting our planes that are fighting terrorism. This is happening despite the agreement we have signed with our American partners to prevent air incidents, and, as you know, Turkey is among those who are supposed to be fighting terrorism within the American coalition."


"If Isis is making so much money – we are talking about tens or maybe even hundreds of millions, possibly billions of dollars – in oil trade and they are supported by the armed forces of an entire state, it is clear why they are being so daring and impudent, why they are killing people in such gruesome ways, why they are committing terrorist attacks all over the world, including in the heart of Europe"

Guy is pissed yo

 

[liu]

If the russian jet had already left Turkey, did Turkey still have the right to shoot it down?

 

[spireite]

If the russian jet had already left Turkey, did Turkey still have the right to shoot it down?

No. It's a massive over-reaction. I don't think it's a co-incidence that this happened just as everything was starting to fall together in a single mind in the fight against IS. Fuck Turkey

 

[HertsWolf]

Is it possible there was mistaken identity? The Syrian AF has Su-24s as well.
The Turkish government are saying the aircraft was warned ten times over a 5 minute period.
I do find it curious how belligerent the Turkish are over this. Russia is a huge trading partner and they share many concerns about security and development in Central Asia.

 

[Dr Mantis Toboggan]

turkey hate assad russia back assad there's a conflict of interest

edit: someone renamed this thread. wtf. #ian4mod

 

[HertsWolf]

turkey hate assad russia back assad there's a conflict of interest

edit: someone renamed this thread. wtf. #ian4mod

Yeh, I get that but still.....Turkey is really playing with fire I would have thought. It just doesn't seem smart. I would have thought it would have been easier to be conciliatory and apologetic (even if smug "there! that fucking showed you!" faces behind the closed curtains).

 

[AFCB_Mark]

It could all be down to one individual hot headed Turkish middle rank officer wanting to make a name for himself, who made a terrible rash call. I imagine the few minutes in which it all unfolded is little time for an incursion to head all the way up the chain of command, from radar station operator to senior military official / politician?

 

[HertsWolf]

If I was a middle-ranking officer flunkey in a remote airbase of any air force on the planet, the very, very last plane I'd want to have shot down on my watch would be a Russian one. On the plus side, you probably get to be a national hero. But the negative side is Putin.

 

[Dr Mantis Toboggan]

they have ROEs and turkey's position has been made clear, so it can hardly be construed as a mistake or down to a flunky

 

[HertsWolf]

they have ROEs and turkey's position has been made clear, so it can hardly be construed as a mistake or down to a flunky

It's the military. There's always someone tasked with being the Officer Commanding, Blame. He possibly won't know of his appointment to this important position yet but he will do soon. He will be reporting to the Stores for Underpants, Strong, Brown, 1 Pair by the weekend.

 

[Dr Mantis Toboggan]

17 seconds

 

[Martino Knockavelli]

The authorial tone of international relations communiques is even more aggravating than that of internet forum moderators.

 

[Blitzballer]

This stuff really worries me. I try and keep out of threads such as this.
But, correct me if wrong, but Russian aircraft shot down by Turkey (nato member) for violating its airspace for 17 seconds, even though Turkey said it warned the aircraft over 20 times?? Turkey also a supporter of Syrian rebels against Assad. Russia a supporter of Assad who's been bombing rebels armed by the US, the same rebels who took out that landed russian helicopter.
So much of a clusterfuck. Before my grandfather died (ww2 vet) he said all this was coming in future years.
I can't see a solution tbf

 

[Abertawe]

This stuff really worries me. I try and keep out of threads such as this.
But, correct me if wrong, but Russian aircraft shot down by Turkey (nato member) for violating its airspace for 17 seconds, even though Turkey said it warned the aircraft over 20 times?? Turkey also a supporter of Syrian rebels against Assad. Russia a supporter of Assad who's been bombing rebels armed by the US, the same rebels who took out that landed russian helicopter.
So much of a clusterfuck. Before my grandfather died (ww2 vet) he said all this was coming in future years.
I can't see a solution tbf

Sold.

 

[Dr Mantis Toboggan]

why are ww2 medals being posted here

 

[Techno Natch]

I think Blitz misunderstood Aber and thought he was questioning if his grandfather was a WW2 veteran.

 

[Martino Knockavelli]

Three generations of the Knockavelli family served in the Wrens.

We will remember them.

 

[mnb089mnb]

Crisp, clear image too. Perhaps you could give Blitzballer some photography tips.

 

[Martino Knockavelli]

My Aunt Tabitha (on the right) was the original author of the dictum "never get involved in a land war in Asia", now commonly misattributed to the Sicilian hoodlum Vizzini.

I think of her insight often, as the world slides inexorably into a Tartarus of annihilation and atrocity.

 

[Blitzballer]

why are ww2 medals being posted here

Sorry I deleted my posts.

 

[Martino Knockavelli]

Well now I look like a buffoon.

 

[Dave-Vale]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...target-after-plane-shot-down-by-a6747721.html

For fucks sake.

This whole 'my dicks bigger than yours' stuff is going to bring about WW3.

Britain needs to stay the fuck out of this for the time being, at least until Russia and Turkey decide on whether they're going to have a fisticuffs or not.

 

[HertsWolf]

why are ww2 medals being posted here

We are collecting medals to melt down for the rebuilding of the new Istanbul after the old one was levelled.

 

[liu]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...target-after-plane-shot-down-by-a6747721.html

For fucks sake.

This whole 'my dicks bigger than yours' stuff is going to bring about WW3.

Britain needs to stay the fuck out of this for the time being, at least until Russia and Turkey decide on whether they're going to have a fisticuffs or not.

Did Russia send their warships there via Turkey's straits?

Edit: Guess they used Gibraltar, so no way you can stay out of this.

 

[Dr Mantis Toboggan]

Did Russia send their warships there via Turkey's straits?

Edit: Guess they used Gibraltar, so no way you can stay out of this.

turkey is nato so no way they could stay out of it from the outset

 

[HertsWolf]

I am assuming that Russia will launch nuclear missiles at Turkish cities. Because Turkey doesn't have nuclear weapons. Apparently this is how deterrence works.

 

[Dr Mantis Toboggan]

the dream of every russian leader back to the tsars has been to retake constantinople and create the fourth rome

 

[Dr Mantis Toboggan]

greece says 'fuck the eu' and shoots down turkish plane. joins glorious orthodox alliance with russia

"The Syrian military alleged that the fighter aircraft had violated Syrian airspace. However, Turkish president Abdullah Gül and other spokesmen have not confirmed this, though Gül said that "it is routine for jet fighters to sometimes fly in and out over [national] borders"."

loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool

 

[Look Out There Are Llamas]

Sergei Lavrov claiming that it's a pre-determined attack by Turkey. Russian co-pilot claims they did not violate Turkish airspace and that they received no warnings.