UKIP Thread

[HertsWolf]

They have no chance of winning so they can promise whatever they like really.

They have a realistic chance of holding the balance of power.

Ask yourself if there is no overall majority, do you think the 'average' Tory MP would be pressing for deals to be done with the Lib Dems again? Or UKIP?

And changing from one form of immigration control to another form of immigration control wouldn't appear to be a U turn....

 

[SUTSS]

UKIP won't get enough seats to hold the balance of power.

 

[Modernist]

They have a realistic chance of holding the balance of power.

Ask yourself if there is no overall majority, do you think the 'average' Tory MP would be pressing for deals to be done with the Lib Dems again? Or UKIP?

And changing from one form of immigration control to another form of immigration control wouldn't appear to be a U turn....

Having a cap and then saying then saying they don't want to be obseesed with caps and now not having a workable one is a U turn.

 

[Modernist]

UKIP won't get enough seats to hold the balance of power.

Unfortunately I'm not sure that will be the case.

Anyone see the UKIP programme last night?, dear oh dear, I guess unsurprisingly they have their fair share of racist, misinformed and down right stupid voting for them.....maybe all parties have that though.

 

[SUTSS]

If UKIP got more than about 12 seats it would be a huge victory for them. They'd need to be looking at 30+ to be a genuinely viable coalition partner.

 

[HertsWolf]

If UKIP got more than about 12 seats it would be a huge victory for them. They'd need to be looking at 30+ to be a genuinely viable coalition partner.

I would suspect they would consider more than 6 seats as being a huge victory. (6 being the number the SDP won at their first General Election). It doesn't take much of a swing to SNP in Scotland to make the UKIP vote in England more important than it might currently seem.

I'm not sure I have ever used the word "viable" but I do see deals being done. I also suspect that if Labour win **and** UKIP do "well" (defined as?) then you could well see a lot more defections from the Tories to UKIP in subsequent years.

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

I hope they do win quite a few seats to be honest, not enough to hold any balance of power, but enough to make the big parties take the protest vote seriously.

 

[HertsWolf]

I hope they do win quite a few seats to be honest, not enough to hold any balance of power, but enough to make the big parties take the protest vote seriously.

I agree. I think the Greens and UKIP....maybe even Gorgeous George... are breaking the left-right mould. The young, the old and the dispossessed are not seeing their future with the established parties. The screeching, rather hysterical response of these established parties to newcomers makes for interesting times. If they weren't a threat, I sense they wouldn't bother having a go at UKIP.

The other day there was something happened....I am trying to think what it was but nothing to do with immigration...and the views of Nige were up there with the views of Call Me Dave, Ed and that other bloke, the one from Sheffield....little bloke....you know..... Anyway, I don't recall that happening before.

 

[Alty]

Having a cap and then saying then saying they don't want to be obseesed with caps and now not having a workable one is a U turn.

Not really. A U-Turn is fundamentally changing your approach to something. Like the LDs saying they wanted to abolish tuition fees, only to treble them. Or the Tories saying they wanted immigration down to the tens of thousands per year, only to see it rise to 298,000 net.

UKIP want a large reduction in immigration, facilitated by EU withdrawal and the introduction of new entry criteria. Whether they go for a hard cap or a 20,000-50,000 range is neither here nor there really. We all know where they stand.

If UKIP got more than about 12 seats it would be a huge victory for them. They'd need to be looking at 30+ to be a genuinely viable coalition partner.

Pretty sure they don't want to be coalition partners. They'll just block a no-confidence vote and support budgets on the proviso they get a quick referendum.

As things stand I think they'll get about 8 seats. Which, given the electoral system, will be a hell of an acievement. And will expose even more clearly the lunacy of FPTP.

 

[The Paranoid Pineapple]

It certainly seems as though we'll have more austerity to look forward to should they be in a position to influence matters http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-31656700 Can't wait!!!

 

[silkyman]

UKIP won't get enough seats to hold the balance of power.

Technically, that COULD be one seat.

 

[The Paranoid Pineapple]

I see Nige "not a racist" Farage is back in the news for erm... being a bit of a racist http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-31846453

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

I don't think you can call him a racist for that, or if you do, you could use the same rationale against anyone who supports freedom of expression. A distinction should probably be made though between a British company discriminating in favour of British nationals, and a British firm refusing to hire someone because they're black. I don't think they're the same thing.

 

[.V.]

You don't think the best person for the job should get it EB? Regardless of ethnicity, race etc.

 

[Alty]

He's basically talking about British jobs for British workers, isn't he? Could swear I've heard that before...

Can't say I think this is a wise move, but the widespread misrepresentation is pathetic and once again makes it look like the establishment are engaging in a smear campaign.

 

[The Paranoid Pineapple]

Is he being misrepresented?

The Channel 4 programme makers say they have not misrepresented Mr Farage's views.

"He was asked a direct question on whether there would be a law against discrimination on the grounds of race or colour and he replied no," they said.

Perhaps the documentary will clear this up.

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

You don't think the best person for the job should get it EB? Regardless of ethnicity, race etc.

I don't think British businesses should be able to discriminate based on race or ethnicity, but I do think they should be able to discriminate in favour of British nationals.

 

[Tilbury]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotla...cs&ns_source=twitter&ns_linkname=news_central#

 

[Red]

I don't think British businesses should be able to discriminate based on race or ethnicity, but I do think they should be able to discriminate in favour of British nationals.

You're contradicting yourself. Everyone belongs to an ethnic group. You're saying on one hand that there should be no discrimination and on the other saying employers should be allowed to discriminate in favour of people with white British ethnicity.

Farage's mask is slipping.

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

You're contradicting yourself. Everyone belongs to an ethnic group. You're saying on one hand that there should be no discrimination and on the other saying employers should be allowed to discriminate in favour of people with white British ethnicity.

I said British nationals, not ethnic Britons.

 

[Gladders]

You're contradicting yourself. Everyone belongs to an ethnic group. You're saying on one hand that there should be no discrimination and on the other saying employers should be allowed to discriminate in favour of people with white British ethnicity.

Farage's mask is slipping.

Since when were all British nationals white?

 

[Red]

Since when did I say all British nationals were white?

 

[Red]

I said British nationals, not ethnic Britons.

I understand why you take this position because it would discourage people from other countries coming here.

I'd discriminate too on the grounds of the best person for the job gets it. Are you in favour of positive discrimination in other instances then?

 

[Gladders]

Since when did I say all British nationals were white?

you implied it with your post by quoting EB and writing white British ethnicity

 

[Red]

Or maybe because I cited one particular ethnic group you jumped to the conclusion that I didn't realise there were others.

It's disappointing that EG wants us to regress back to a time when people were excluded from applying for jobs even if they're more suitable for a job than someone else who is eligible.

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

I understand why you take this position because it would discourage people from other countries coming here.

There's a much more obvious explanation.

Are you in favour of positive discrimination in other instances then?

I can't think of any off the top of my head.

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

It's disappointing that EG wants us to regress back to a time when people were excluded from applying for jobs even if they're more suitable for a job than someone else who is eligible.

I never said anyone should be excluded from applying for jobs, I said that employers should be free to choose British nationals over foreigners if they have a mind to. Besides, we already have jobs that are only open to British nationals or people of select nationalities and always have done.

 

[Gladders]

Or maybe because I cited one particular ethnic group you jumped to the conclusion that I didn't realise there were others.

Or maybe you are backtracking because there was no need to cite one particular ethnic group

 

[Red]

I never said anyone should be excluded from applying for jobs, I said that employers should be free to choose British nationals over foreigners if they have a mind to. Besides, we already have jobs that are only open to British nationals or people of select nationalities and always have done.

You didn't say anyone should be excluded, but you'd be quite happy for legislation that allows it, which is what it would boil down to. Isn't a more sensible approach one where the person best suited for the job gets it, regardless of their age, race, nationality, ethnicity etc?

Thankfully we've progressed and left all that discriminating on certain grounds behind us in the 70s, but it seems Farage and some people want to go back to it.

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

You didn't say anyone should be excluded, but you'd be quite happy for legislation that allows it, which is what it would boil down to. Isn't a more sensible approach one where the person best suited for the job gets it, regardless of their age, race, nationality, ethnicity etc?

The point of British law and the British state is to serve British nationals first and foremost, so it seems eminently sensible to me to allow for British businesses to operate likewise. I certainly can't see any reason to legislate against it, and you haven't offered any.

Thankfully we've progressed and left all that discriminating on certain grounds behind us in the 70s, but it seems Farage and some people want to go back to it.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't you a supporter of affirmative action?