UKIP Thread

[Ebeneezer Goode]

There's a really creepy brand of puritanical social justice warrior emerging these days who seem to think they can rationalize pretty much any sort of attack so long as the victim is someone they've judged to be bigoted. Those nutty groups in Sweden are probably a taste of what's to come as far as (for lack of a better term) the far left are concerned.

 

[Techno Natch]

I can not stand the bloke but that's way out of order.

 

[silkyman]

The Indy has a slightly different slant.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...pub-and-scare-away-his-children-10126032.html

No kids involved

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

Well no, that isn't what they're reporting, they're reporting that the protest organizer says he "didn't see any kids".

 

[SUTSS]

There's a really creepy brand of puritanical social justice warrior emerging these days who seem to think they can rationalize pretty much any sort of attack so long as the victim is someone they've judged to be bigoted. Those nutty groups in Sweden are probably a taste of what's to come as far as (for lack of a better term) the far left are concerned.

And they perceive someone as being bigoted if they don't agree 100% with their dogmatism.

 

[Alty]

TBH whether his kids were there or not it's not really defensible, is it? Self-important wankers.

 

[Red]

I'm beginning to think you're purposely swerving the question I asked you EG. In case you genuinely missed it here it is

You think there's a racist (don't know why you used that term), undercurrent from the Labour types regarding this? What are you basing that on?

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

I am ignoring it because the post you're responding to already answers your question. I'm not getting drawn into a long and boring debate about the validity of a suspicion I hold that can't be proven either way.

 

[Tilbury]

The private life of famous people/celebrities has really become too invaded and I think this is another example (as much as I detest the man). Although I do think the irony is lost on certain sections of the press though when they report on how horrible these people are doing this.

 

[Ian_Wrexham]

TBH whether his kids were there or not it's not really defensible, is it? Self-important wankers.

Thought it was pretty funny to be honest. Nigel Farage, intimidated out of a pub by it being taken over by breast-feeding mothers, rainbow flags and drag queens.

Like, he delegitimises these people's existence - it's pretty much fair game that they peacefully disrupt his Sunday lunch.

 

[Alty]

Delegitimises their existence? I think you may be getting just a tad carried away.

 

[Ian_Wrexham]

Delegitimises their existence? I think you may be getting just a tad carried away.

Well, he doesn't think HIV+ people should be entitled to normal human rights - e.g. the right of asylum. Having his pub taken over by drag queens is a pretty minor provocation in comparison.

It looked like the performance/celebration a hell of a lot of fun for everyone involved, with the possible exception of Farage, and I'm guessing dabke-dancing drag queens probably improved Farage's local.

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

I'm pretty sure you don't have to be LGTBQIA to have HIV.

 

[HertsWolf]

The private life of famous people/celebrities has really become too invaded and I think this is another example (as much as I detest the man). Although I do think the irony is lost on certain sections of the press though when they report on how horrible these people are doing this.

I agree with this. While anyone in public office has to accept some invasion of privacy, this was abhorrent.

I was amused last week to hear a cleared Sun journalist moaning about how the accusations of phone-hacking and subsequent court cases had affected the journalists' families. The irony was totally lost on him.

 

[SUTSS]

All the protest does is win Farage sympathy points so what is the point?

 

[HertsWolf]

All the protest does is win Farage sympathy points so what is the point?

I thought that too. A frightening prospect is a late surge in support for those fringe parties that the established parties like to demonise....SNP, UKIP, Greens, the LibDems.....giving them the balance of power.

 

[Tilbury]

I very much have sympathy for those protesting, just a little too far this time.

 

[Techno Natch]

This was an interesting read. http://www.theguardian.com/stage/2015/mar/23/beyond-ukip-cabaret-nigel-farage

I still don't agree with what happened though.

 

[Alty]

Well, he doesn't think HIV+ people should be entitled to normal human rights - e.g. the right of asylum. Having his pub taken over by drag queens is a pretty minor provocation in comparison.

It looked like the performance/celebration a hell of a lot of fun for everyone involved, with the possible exception of Farage, and I'm guessing dabke-dancing drag queens probably improved Farage's local.

He's a politician who advocates, amongst other things, refusing the right of entry to Britain of anyone with a life-threatening disease. If you disagree, fine. Good. But just counter his arguments reasonably. Don't harass the bloke.

 

[The Paranoid Pineapple]

Hmm, I'm sympathetic to the position of the protesters but I don't think they've done themselves many favours - a "carnival of diversity" is all well and good but in electing to target Farage's local they've personalised it. When you do that you rather lay yourselves open to charges of harassment even if the bulk of your activities are good-natured. I think he's a pretty rotten person and that they're a pretty rotten party; that they play upon people's fears and seek to marginalise certain groups of people. The fact that he has a public platform to promote these views means I'm fairly unsympathetic as to his plight. But my basic sense of fair play says that accosting a man when he's trying to enjoy a meal out with his family isn't really on either - at the very least it seems a fairly obnoxious, and probably quite a counter-productive way to make your point.

 

[silkyman]

Had they done it outside an official ukip event, or at a speech then it would have been a great protest. Stupid to give him any sort of opportunity for sympathy.

 

[Ian_Wrexham]

He's a politician who advocates, amongst other things, refusing the right of entry to Britain of anyone with a life-threatening disease. If you disagree, fine. Good. But just counter his arguments reasonably. Don't harass the bloke.

UKIP, and to a lesser extent mainstream politics as a whole, isn't really about debate, arguments and dialectics. Reasoned argument isn't and hasn't been the primary way we make decisions, never has been and even if it was, the sorts of people who were countering Farage are never offered a platform to advance their "reasoned argument" (that generally involves asserting their own right to exist, work and live in places they won't get blown up/arrested).

Farage, meanwhile, has pretty much every newspaper and TV channel at his beck and call to dehumanise and demonise. The platforms are massively asymmetric - it's like shouting at a sky-writer. The opportunity to debate isn't there (and really, the sort of stuff that they're saying shouldn't be up for debate anyway).

So with that in mind, I fully support this sort of harassment. Harass him until he fucks off out of public life.

 

[Red]

I am ignoring it because the post you're responding to already answers your question. I'm not getting drawn into a long and boring debate about the validity of a suspicion I hold that can't be proven either way.

I was simply asking you what you based your suspicion on. Your refusal to answer it again leads me to believe your suspicion is based on fuck all.

 

[Alty]

The sorts of people who are opposed to Farage are never given a platform to advance their reasoned arguments? What fucking planet are you on?

Ian_Wrexham

 

[Ian_Wrexham]

The sorts of people who are opposed to Farage are never given a platform to advance their reasoned arguments? What fucking planet are you on?

Ian_Wrexham

The people who are physically endangered, marginalised or demonised by Farage's rhetoric and policies rarely get a voice or a platform, no.

 

[.V.]

http://www.buzzfeed.com/patrickstrudwick/former-chair-of-ukips-gay-group-calls-the-party-a-cult-that

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

Amazing how quickly the democratic process and basic civility can be dispensed with once it gets in the way of this new social justice religion.

 

[Alty]

Amazing how quickly the democratic process and basic civility can be dispensed with once it gets in the way of this new social justice religion.

Indeed.

That said, the Buzzfeed thing reads true. I can well believe the idea they've gone to their gay MEP for a LGBT policy raher than actually engaging with their own LGBT group. And while like any party UKIP contains a mixture of elements, I wouldn't be surprised if homophobia is encountered semi-regularly.

 

[Red]

New social justice religion?

 

[The Paranoid Pineapple]

New social justice religion?

Quite... not really got the foggiest as to what that sentence is supposed to mean