Big Sam - New England Manager

[lordofthepies]

I'd be happy for the FA to appoint a German. I don't care where the manager is from, I'd just like them to offer the job to the best man.

 

[smat]

I'd be happy for the FA to appoint a German. I don't care where the manager is from, I'd just like them to offer the job to the best man.

lol idiot

 

[lordofthepies]

lol idiot

i'd actually prefer him (or HER?!?!?!?) to be a german to any other nationality

 

[Baz]

You're biggest mistake was not going for Chris Coleman.

 

[epic73]

You're biggest mistake was not going for Chris Coleman.

Your biggest mistake was using bad grammar.

 

[mnb089mnb]

His time will come. What he has done at Bournemouth is brilliant but Bournemouth to England is a massive leap. .

Is it? I'm not so sure.

Would you say the same if he were a German woman? Somehow, I doubt it.

 

[FrazerLloyd]

Is it? I'm not so sure.

Would you say the same if he were a German woman? Somehow, I doubt it.

I don't quite get your point.

Still, I think taking Bournemouth from League Two to the Premier League, and then staying there, is a pretty big feat.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

Is it? I'm not so sure.

Would you say the same if he were a German woman? Somehow, I doubt it.

Maybe Angela Merkel could get the best out of Raheem Sterling.

 

[mnb089mnb]

England think they're an elite nation. The mindset needs to change from top to bottom with regards to expectations and the way the players are treated. It won't happen though, unfortunately.

 

[mnb089mnb]

Maybe Angela Merkel could get the best out of Raheem Sterling.

I think running Germany is a darn sight easier than trying to manage the England national side.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

England think they're an elite nation. The mindset needs to change from top to bottom with regards to expectations and the way the players are treated. It won't happen though, unfortunately.

If you mean the FA are out of touch, I'd agree with you wholeheartedly. But "England" - could you be any more specific? We aren't one homogeneous hive mind.

I would argue that soundbite in general hasn't had much credence for about 10 years probably since Germany 2006, or perhaps earlier. Lazy of you.

 

[mnb089mnb]

The FA.

Additionally the media don't help in the way they treat the players either. After seeing a piece in the Daily Mail I'm surprised many of them don't just retire from international football.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

Well we can hope for the best from Greg Dyke's successor. That's all gone rather quiet if I may say, but is arguably just as important as whoever takes on the England Manager role for the next few years. There's only so much the bloke at the top can so, but he does set a tone.

 

[FrazerLloyd]

I used to work in an office block in London and the guy who worked the door had a son who worked for Hull City as a coach.

His son was sent on one of these coaching courses abroad and found that foreign coaches were mocking St George's Park, laughing about how it was such a typically English way to deal with a problem.

Foreign coaches pointed to how things had been done in the likes of Germany and Holland. Instead of building one world class building for the elite costing £100m for example, they'd build 100 good buildings for the general populace, costing £1m.

This is where I think the problem with English football lies. None of the money from the Premier League trickles down.

If we ensured that each of the 92 clubs in the country had good training facilities and that grass root players weren't playing on pitches covered in craters and dog shit then perhaps we'd start to produce some better players.

What's more, we need to stop big clubs hoarding youngsters. Playing for Man United Youth in front of your parents and a few anoraks is not the same as playing for Plymouth Argyle, playing in front of real supporters who will hold you accountable for your performances.

If we limited the size of youth squads, and said teams could only register 25 players per squad, then inevitably some of the youngsters in the Premier League would have to find clubs elsewhere as their parent clubs would have to stick to a quota.

Neither of the above will ever happen as the FA have jack shit power over of the Premier League, but in theory we could certainly put the new TV deal to better use.

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

The primary concern is not grass roots player development. At the younger age groups - our current U16s especially - we're as good as anyone. We start to fall behind when you get into the sorts of age groups where other countries players are getting first team football. But even that is not our most pressing problem. We didn't lose to Iceland because we didn't have the players, we lost because we didn't have the right belief and organization. A lot of people have put this down to the "academy generation" being mindless robots who can't solve problems on the field, but where do these people suppose that Wales get their players from? It's not from a Welsh academy system (or even Wales in many cases), it's from the English academy system. The raw materials are there to perform far better than we have with the right coach, and addressing the dearth in quality coaches is what SGP was built for.

If we limited the size of youth squads, and said teams could only register 25 players per squad, then inevitably some of the youngsters in the Premier League would have to find clubs elsewhere as their parent clubs would have to stick to a quota.

I'm pretty sure that's already the case. It's certainly true that most squads have fewer players than 25, with lads regularly jumping between age groups to make up the numbers. Even Chelsea only has 19 players in their U21 squad. I think the likelier solution is to relax the loan rules and let players gain experience elsewhere.

 

[FrazerLloyd]

I'm pretty sure that's already the case. It's certainly true that most squads have fewer players than 25, with lads regularly jumping between age groups to make up the numbers. Even Chelsea only has 19 players in their U21 squad. I think the likelier solution is to relax the loan rules and let players gain experience elsewhere.

Didn't Chelsea loan out 30 players last season? Argyle are lucky to have a permanent squad of 20!

The loan system is largely flawed in my opinion. Half of the time, the players don't care. They have nothing to lose should the team do badly. They know they'll just go back to their parent clubs, happy as Larry. It is this mentality that you can see throughout the England national team. Sterling doesn't care about Euro 2016. Just look at his behaviour afterwards!

When you do get a loanee that pust the effort in though, lower league teams are spending time and effort on players, for bigger clubs to pick up the spoils. You can develop a player, give them their first taste of first team football and a platform to shine on, for him to leave and be sold or loaned out to a bigger fish.

If we forced players to join Football League clubs due to squad quotas, they'd have to put the effort in. They'd either have to fight for a place at a big club, or play for their futures at a smaller one. What's more, if a player developed well at a smaller club, that club could benefit from his transfer, allowing them to spend funds on improving the club as a whole.

We have 92 clubs in this country, and that's excluding non-league! We should be bossing international football.

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

I don't see the point in proposing solutions that we know Premier League clubs would never agree to.

 

[Dirk]

@FrazerLloyd , @ Ebeneezer Goode : Both of you have valid points here.

It's not that the England Squad lacks talent, on the contrary, actually they have plenty of it, just to name Rashford, Delli Alli, Harry Kane and so on. But it has to be a "mentally thing" when the Three Lions come to an tournament, I don't know?

I mean, 3 months before the Euro I saw the Germany vs England match in Berlin and I was overwhelmed to see the England style on this evening. After 0-2 down they won 3-2 against us. OK, it was only a friendly and Germany tends to be a bit lazy in friendlies but that's not an excuse because England was fantastic in this match. Even the German Newspapers were full of praise for the England team.
Normally they would have condemned the German team for giving away a 2-0 lead (you can imagine the outrage we had here after the 4-4 against Sweden in the World Cup Qualifier for WC2014 where we gave away a 4-0 in 30 minutes). But not this time they praised the refreshing style of the Three Lions and their talents in the Squad.
And then the Euro, with the same bunch of talents and I couldn't believe what I just saw. Suddenly nearly all of them seem to be out of form. (Rashford came too late in the Iceland match but you can't depend on an 18year old teen to change this miserable match against Iceland).

So, what is it with England and Tournaments?

 

[AFCB_Mark]

It's a good post Dirk . And for a long time the reason given has been "they're all tired & knackered after a hard long club season, we need to reduce the number of games"

Except in recent years English clubs have had fewer games due to being pish in Europe, and the cup competitions have increasingly become reserve tournaments. Also plenty of our squad had fairly significant periods of injury through the season that resulted in them playing plenty games fewer than they might otherwise. Of our squad, only 13 completed 40 games last season.

So I'm not sure that argument holds much sway any longer.

 

[FrazerLloyd]

They don't care, they're arrogant, they're complacent and to be honest very few of them are atcually world class, if any at all!

 

[Dirk]

It's a good post Dirk . And for a long time the reason given has been "they're all tired & knackered after a hard long club season, we need to reduce the number of games"

OK, some could argue about the games. A bit is already done with the Replays in the FA Cup? And this League Cup? Is this really necessary? OK the winner is guaranteed a spot in the European Competition but this League Cup is a "disturbance" for most PL Clubs, at least it's the impression I have. Maybe I'm wrong.
But you are right, most PL clubs field a Reserve team for a match against lower class opponents. But nonetheless I don't see the sense for this competition. League and Cup that should be enough (imo)

But on the other hand the German or Spanish players in the CL Clubs have many games, too. And some are tired, too (look at Thomas Müller at the Euro. A man who scored 10 World Cup Goals in 13 Games but failed to score one in 2 Euros and he was obviously tiread but in the Italy Match he ran for 15 km in the match and gave all he could (although he was awful but he tried to do his best all the times)

Some say that the Premier League should have a Winter break like some Continental Leagues (e.g Bundesliga) so that the Players can "recharge". But I am against it: First it's a long tradition in England and second: You have no guarantee that the players reach their level again when they are out of competition for 4 - 6 weeks. Originally the Winter Break in the Bundesliga wasn't for "recharging the batteries" of the Players but due to bad weather with heavy snow. But with today's climate change in Middle Europe we mostly haven't any snow at all during those period (and when the season resumes in End January/Begin of February we then have the match cancellations due to unplayable fields )

They don't care, they're arrogant, they're complacent and to be honest very few of them are atcually world class, if any at all!

You don't need to have world class players for a very good team if the players are functioning as a team it's mostly even better than with one Superstar in the team (see the actual swedish team at the Euro they were so dependable to Ibrahimovic. And when he doesn't bring his best performance the team is lost.)

You say that the English players don't care and that they're arrogant. If that's true than this would be a shame and this has to change asap.
All I can say, that in Germany the Nationalteam has the highest status, higher than the clubs. And the Bundesliga Clubs know that and the relationship between the German FA (DFB) and the German League Organisation (DFL) is very good. Both organisations know that they can succeed if they work closely together. Wolfgang Holzhäuser, a responsible spokesman of Bayer Leverkusen once said, in place of the other 17 clubs that "we treat the German National Team as if it is the 19th member of the Bundesliga, the best member"
OK, maybe a bit exaggerated this statement but the direction is obvious. German FA and the Bundesliga are staying together and work complementary.

And for the German Players it's still the ultimate Aim to be a player for the National-team, "die Mannschaft".
Look at Bastian Schweinsteiger who could have end his career in the National team after the World Cup but he didn't. Although in the 2 years after the World Cup he was mostly injured but he fight his way back in the team and he played a good Euro (ok, his hand played a decisive and unlucky role in the semi-final against France but his performance before was good). Or Lukas Podolski who has now nearly 130 matches but is only a reserve player since the World Cup 2014 but he is very important for the team because with his positive attitude he helps the young players and they all praise him for that. Normally you would say "Hey, nearly 130 matches for the team and only substituted for minutes in both tournaments, I should retire" but he's proud to be a part of the team and it's an honour for him to wear the dress with the federal eagle on the chest. That's the attitude of nearly all German Players. They honour the dress and are proud to represent Germany.

And you think that's not the case (anymore) for the English players? That would be a shame

 

[MJA]

Am I right in thinking that the 2 English front-runners are Sam Allardyce and Steve Bruce? Might as well have stuck with Hodgson.

Klinsmann's name is still being mentioned and to be honest I think I would prefer him to either of the above.

I still think Hoddle should be considered though

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

They don't care, they're arrogant, they're complacent and to be honest very few of them are atcually world class, if any at all!

I don't believe that at all. They look completely bereft of confidence to me, if anything.

 

[Renegade]

Am I right in thinking that the 2 English front-runners are Sam Allardyce and Steve Bruce? Might as well have stuck with Hodgson.

Klinsmann's name is still being mentioned and to be honest I think I would prefer him to either of the above.

I still think Hoddle should be considered though

You don't want Allardyce, but you would consider a guy who hasn't managed in over a decade and was managing at a lower level than Big Sam the last time we saw him in the dugout? A man that has already failed with England?



I do not understand the love Hoddle still seems to get from some fans. He was an average manager and is an even worse pundit. Absence making the heart grow fonder, time healing all wounds?

 

[FrazerLloyd]

I don't believe that at all. They look completely bereft of confidence to me, if anything.

How fragile are these players?

They all play in the Premier League, with the vast majority of them playing for the biggest clubs, they've all represented England prior to the tournament and some of them have played in Europe. Heck, some of them have won the Champions League!

Yet when they come up against the footballing super powers of Russia, Wales, Slovakia and bloody Iceland, they are supposedly lacking in confidence. I'd suggest that if given their pedigree they weren't confident against any of that opposition, then they should sack the whole thing in and get a job at Sainsbury's.

Sorry for getting angry pal. It isn't with you, but with the utter shower of shit we've been served up time and time again at major tournaments.

There are fundamental problems with English football, which in fairness do limit our chances of winning, or even challenging for, the major trophies. But if Wales can get to a semi final with Robson Kanu up front, we should be winning against those four opponents every day of the week.

 

[MJA]

You don't want Allardyce, but you would consider a guy who hasn't managed in over a decade and was managing at a lower level than Big Sam the last time we saw him in the dugout? A man that has already failed with England?

I would have no concerns over Hoddle coming back into management in such a high profile job after having such a break from it. The style of play he looked to adopt in the late 90's was way ahead of its time and is the type of football people are crying out for now. He would take a group of talented young players and mould them into a strong attacking force which actually has the first idea who to breach opposition defences.

As for him failing with England, the 98 World Cup campaign came to an end following a silly red card, us more than holding our own for nigh on 75 minutes, having a goal chalked off in ET that could easily have been allowed and then losing on penalties. The run to the final that year would have been difficult but had we got through the Argentina game, there was nothing to suggest we wouldn't give the best nations a run for their money. Had he not opened his mouth about his beliefs, I firmly believe that we would have been a force at Euro 2000 (we certainly wouldn't have gone out at the group stage). A 60% win rate, only bettered by Sir Alf Ramsey I believe, speaks for itself really.

As for Allardyce, what is he going to bring to us that Hodgson didn't? His strength is setting his sides up to not lose games and then seeing if a win can be pinched somewhere down the line - that is why he is generally successful at keeping sides away from relegation. The only thing I can see that he might have over Hodgson is that he may have a little bit more respect from the players as I suspect he won't put up with any prima donna type behaviour but on the pitch I am not so sure his style will take us forward

 

[mnb089mnb]

Sterling doesn't care about Euro 2016. Just look at his behaviour afterwards!

What did Sterling do after Euro 2016?

 

[mnb089mnb]

I don't see the point in proposing solutions that we know Premier League clubs would never agree to.

I've often felt that the FA should sell the England national side to the Premier League. They know how to operate a big brand and get the best out of it.

 

[Modernist]

What did Sterling do after Euro 2016?

Showed off his new mansion etc....

I'd be happy to see premiership players being left out of the england games, they genuinely don't look interested and are failing anyway. Seems like other nations can pick players from down the league (because they have to) and do better than we do.

I honestly don't think a lot of english players would prefer to win the euros than the premiership or Champions league.

 

[mnb089mnb]

Showed off his new mansion etc....

He bought his mother a new house. Obviously on returning from Euro 2016 the first thing he did was visit his mother and the house he had bought her. This was front page news in the Sun.

Anyway, back onto the England team.

Why do players seem to not enjoy playing for England?