European Union Referendum

[Aber gas]

David Davies didn't want to attend the most recent round of exit talks cos it was " too technical"
Bless him.

 

[mowgli]

Talk of a "no deal" Brexit now - basically no-one is really sure what will happen?

When Davis tells Barnier we've had enough of their games and we're leaving without a deal and not giving them a penny i would love to see the look of horror on his face when he realises he's pushed us too far.

 

[Aber gas]

Ah, sweet delusion.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

Interestingly there's a parliamentary select committee meeting with economists today to discuss a 'no deal' situation, one of whom (Ruth Lea) being an economist who has banged the drum for a no deal leave for months now (link). So it seems the government really are sounding this option out, and I guess they'd get stick for not considering all bases.

However to my mind It's not in anyone's interest to just walk away I don't think. The EU could really do with the extra couple of years to shuffle round their contributors, taxation and expenditure to make up for the 20Bn budget hole they will experience going forward (link). And I imagine UK businesses and the economy would prefer a staged exit period so there's no 'cliff edge' (link) to world trade regulations. No deal really would be a step into the unknown.

 

[Abertawe]

I wouldn't rule out us staying should a "no deal" occur. The government have apparently been given rock solid legal advice that this whole thing can be stopped should it be deemed not in the national interest, even with article 50 having been triggered. Would absolutely ruin the Conservatives as a political force mind.

 

[Aber gas]

Here's a prominent member of the Leave campaign ( and all round odious piece of shit, but that's for another day) spelling out what leaving with no deal means. Summat for people to think about between bouts of meaningless and embarrassing faux patriotism.
https://twitter.com/petenorth303/status/917504922584780800

 

[.V.]

How can anyone think Brexit will be a success with this shower of a government. Where’s the planing for things like this!!!

https://twitter.com/petenorth303/status/918316313109581825

 

[Look Out There Are Llamas]

How can anyone think Brexit will be a success

https://economics.rabobank.com/publications/2017/october/the-permanent-damage-of-brexit/

 

[Veggie Legs]

https://economics.rabobank.com/publications/2017/october/the-permanent-damage-of-brexit/

Reading that has ruined my Friday. How can anyone possibly still think this is a good idea?

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

Can we not just go back to the days when we could answer every question with 'well brexit means brexit' and not say anything else.

Was so much easier for poor mrs may

 

[benzo]

Word from the city is there will be no brexit.

May never intended to deliver a Brexit and called the election expecting to ensure a strong electoral footing whilst she dealt with the fall out. She understood the flak from aborting article 50 but felt the buffer of five years would be sufficient to deliver her vision of Britain and be enough to gain re-election.

Expect brexit tories transfer their clout to a rebranded UKIP. There are high hopes for Henry Bolton - he isn't associated with the negative tropes applied to the UKIP of old and he has significant support from very prominent figures. There are genuine hopes of a common sense party with values conducive to our British way of life having a realistic shot at government.

May attempted to suffocate the brexit proportion of the party but it's backfired. Boris & comrades will roar like Lions.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

The BBC reckon the EU are about to start trade talks with us now, by way of a carrot.

The BBC's Europe correspondent Adam Fleming said the paper has been described as an "opening to the UK" to encourage the government to reach a deal (on other matters) with the EU. The document calls for talks - about a transition period and the future relationship - to move to the next phase "as soon as possible".

The draft conclusions - to be put to EU leaders next Friday - also call for more concessions from the UK on its financial obligations and the rights of European nationals who wish to stay after Brexit.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41604675

Negotiation...Of course it very much remains to be seen what the government can actually get done.

 

[Indian Dan]

If European nationals wish to stay in the UK post Brexit they must adhere to UK law and not EU law.

British nationals living in the EU will be subject to EU law. Nobody’s saying they should revert back to UK law.

Seems logical to me. Live in this country, play by the rules.

 

[Laker]

A lot of the tone yesterday from Barnier was very dramatic as if to try to ramp up the pressure on the UK. However it's important the UK doesn't get rattled by that as it is just words - the EU is playing a game of chicken and at some point that will end and an agreement will be reached.

Every sane person wants an agreement however the UK government is correct to pursue the no deal scenario to demonstrate to the EU that we are not just going to agree to every demand the EU sticks our way. Ultimately it looks like the citizen issue will be resolved and the Irish border solution reached so it'll come down to money, effectively agreeing what we'll pay in the divorce bill for some sort of single market access.

One has to remember that whenever we left there would always be this divorce bill, but what leaving now does is reduces/nullifies further future commitments. And that's the point, get out and use that cash how we want.

Anyway the perception is doom and gloom, and I think it suits a remainer to accept that perception. This is a two year negotiation period, panicking and accepting whatever the EU throw at us is not the way to go.

 

[Abertawe]

If European nationals wish to stay in the UK post Brexit they must adhere to UK law and not EU law.

British nationals living in the EU will be subject to EU law. Nobody’s saying they should revert back to UK law.

Seems logical to me. Live in this country, play by the rules.

What sort of laws you thinking?

 

[Aber gas]

‘anging probably. Though that’s probably too good for them.

 

[Abertawe]

I'm sure gonna miss the EU law. W will no longer be able to murder, rape & pillage. Bad times...

 

[Indian Dan]

What sort of laws you thinking?

European Court of Justice should have no sway over anyone living in the UK post Brexit

 

[Abertawe]

European Court of Justice should have no sway over anyone living in the UK post Brexit

That was not the question little Danny.

What laws are you thinking? What can a EU citizen currently do in this country under EU law that they should no longer be able to do post Brexit under RULE BRITANNIA law?

 

[.V.]

That was not the question little Danny.

What laws are you thinking? What can a EU citizen currently do in this country under EU law that they should no longer be able to do post Brexit under RULE BRITANNIA law?

The question most brexiters are unable to answer.

Sky reporting that we will have to pay to progress trade talks. Almost like they hold all the cards and we don’t.

 

[Laker]

That was not the question little Danny.

What laws are you thinking? What can a EU citizen currently do in this country under EU law that they should no longer be able to do post Brexit under RULE BRITANNIA law?

That's such a pointless question and you know it!

 

[PuB]

Anyone who thinks a 'no deal' will do anything other than ruin our service based economy is living in cloud cuckoo land and/or doesn't understand the consequences.

That doesn't mean I'm advocating remain either.

 

[Look Out There Are Llamas]

That's such a pointless question and you know it!

How on earth is it a pointless question?

#BendThoseBananas

 

[Techno Natch]

That's such a pointless question and you know it!

Dan made the statement so I think it's fair to ask the question.

 

[Abertawe]

The question most brexiters are unable to answer.

Sky reporting that we will have to pay to progress trade talks. Almost like they hold all the cards and we don’t.

We were the ones who left so of course we should pay to adhere to previous agreements and ensure that the EU isn't unduly punished because of our decision. Common sense, simple common sense. We were never given the vote for those agreements but the blame for that is in history and we have to navigate the present. Any Brexit head that can't acknowledge this probably get's a hard on when that Sky advert comes on involving a arm wrestle to decide who wins.

We really should've had a back up referendum once Leave was decided. We've spent over a year doing nothing so it's not like they didn't have the time. The electorate could've been informed about the different options and the arguments for & against. Instead we got a general election where the serving government refused give any indication as to it's plan whatsoever above the soundbites about being strong & stable. Labour whilst being stringent on solid detail at least laid out a rough plan of action and apart from far-right non entities it was the only party to do so.

It's SLIGHTLY alarming that it seems to be taking forever to resolve an issue where the solution is obvious, especially after Theresa May implied as much in Florence, that we are still stuck on this juncture. It makes me very suspicious indeed. A no deal would be a dangerous piece of meat and not even the most righty of Tories would have the balls to swallow that surely to god. This secret top legal advice May received that Brexit can be stopped https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/oct/07/theresa-may-secret-advice-brexit-eu makes has me thinking they could well purposely come to a No Deal and declare Brexit as wrong for the country and put it to parliament which would be the ultimate grenade move that would inflict danger to Labour just as much as it would the Tories.

If the government were defeated on such a huge issue it would have to force an election but that isn't going to happen when you've got the SNP, Lib Dems, Remain Tories & Blair yearning PLP members who are still represent the majority within the party. Corbyn being the democratic lad that he is would surely instruct to respect the vote of democracy and we'll attempt to undo the damage caused by the Tories by losing the ego and sorting a deal out before a disaster occurs for the country. If Corbyn is undermined by a majority that would be pretty damaging and would probably result in a split of the party. Feels like the the lines in the sand are going to be redrawn and people are going to have to decide what camp they're in resulting in a dissolving of the two party state we saw in the last election. If disgruntled Leave Tories fail to unseat May they could jump ship to UKIP. Remain Labour could jump ship to Lib Dems or some new Blair invention to avoid being deselected. I think it's about to get very bleary.

That's such a pointless question and you know it!

I was responding to a specific point he made so take issue with him.

 

[Look Out There Are Llamas]

The sooner the two party state fucks off, the better for everyone.

Incidentally, from YouGov:

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

People mostly only talk the rights and bill issues......but that N Ireland border issue is surely going to be 100 times harder to agree on with the 50-50 split within N Ireland

 

[Abertawe]

The sooner the two party state fucks off, the better for everyone.

Incidentally, from YouGov:

Is it fuck it'll allow for the status quo to carry on sailing. How could Corbyn possibly unite the country if the lines are redrawn again in the event of parliament deciding we remain? If he fails to defeat May in parliament and U turns he'll look weak and pathetic. If he sticks to his principles he risks alienating 48% of ref voters and if that You Gov poll is correct would only have the backing of 42% and much of them are probably right leaning heads anyway.

We'll be back to square one where thick as fuck remain liberals will start voting Lib Dems again, right populists voting for a galvanised UKIP, shitty national parties like Plaid & SNP will take advantage of a confused Labour message. They'll all take votes off one another allowing for a revamped centre ground appealing paternalist libertarian Tory party to limp into power for another 5 years and the dream would be over.

 

[TheMinsterman]

That was not the question little Danny.

What laws are you thinking? What can a EU citizen currently do in this country under EU law that they should no longer be able to do post Brexit under RULE BRITANNIA law?

Live here?

 

[PuB]

Phillip Hammond just called the EU 'the enemy'. That's gonna go down well