The proper relegation thread.

[Valeite]

Still 32 games left for us to pull ourselves out of our current position.
In Dave we trust.

Why is Owen Dale on loan at Blackpool?

 

[Mighty Mornflake]

Why is Owen Dale on loan at Blackpool?

I think it's with a view to them buying him outright at some point.
All our best players have departed in the last few months - hence why we're now sitting at the bottom of the table.

 

[kieran_vale]

I think it's with a view to them buying him outright at some point.
All our best players have departed in the last few months - hence why we're now sitting at the bottom of the table.

Always seems to happen with Crewe, bring through a new crop of good players from the academy then go to L1 for a couple of seasons. They then get relegated and repeat the cycle. All clubs at this level are at risk of losing the best players I suppose and under no illusion the same will happen to us with Conlon at some point.

To me I don’t get why Crewe don’t take some of that money though and reinvest it in a proper recruitment strategy as well to go along with the academy. Always thought they were missing a trick on that.

 

[PuB]

I’ve always got the impression that Crewe’s academy status is that expensive to maintain that there’s not a lot of cash left over for the actual squad. Nothing wrong with that of course, it’s kind of their thing, but you only have to have a couple of barren seasons in bringing players through before you’re back in league 2 starting again.

 

[Mighty Mornflake]

I’ve always got the impression that Crewe’s academy status is that expensive to maintain that there’s not a lot of cash left over for the actual squad. Nothing wrong with that of course, it’s kind of their thing, but you only have to have a couple of barren seasons in bringing players through before you’re back in league 2 starting again.

The academy costs around £800,000 a year to run so in simplistic terms we have to sell a player for that amount every year for it to break even.

 

[Mighty Mornflake]

Always seems to happen with Crewe, bring through a new crop of good players from the academy then go to L1 for a couple of seasons. They then get relegated and repeat the cycle. All clubs at this level are at risk of losing the best players I suppose and under no illusion the same will happen to us with Conlon at some point.

To me I don’t get why Crewe don’t take some of that money though and reinvest it in a proper recruitment strategy as well to go along with the academy. Always thought they were missing a trick on that.

Yeh, it's all a balancing act I suppose.
You could say they should push the boat out a bit now and then but how many clubs have got themselves in real serious financial trouble in recent years by over spending or gambling on success which hasn't quite materialised?
We don't have a mega rich owner throwing money at it but we do have a very prudent board who are careful not to allow the club to get into the mess that many others have ended up in.

 

[Bottega Don]

Think Rochdale could be an underrated contender to be relegated with us, they seem to have some real off the field problems and those could easily translate to on the pitch. Hope they don't though as they're a really good club.

 

[Loyal Dale]

Think Rochdale could be an underrated contender to be relegated with us, they seem to have some real off the field problems and those could easily translate to on the pitch. Hope they don't though as they're a really good club.

The recent off field problems were caused mainly by the old CEO, who is a cretin. He was voted off the Board together with another Director at our June AGM.

Those two, together with a couple of large shareholders, had plotted to sell the club (whilst they looked to profit from the sale of their shares) to an outside investor, who planned to borrow against the ground to finance it all.

This was blocked by shareholders, and the ex CEO then introduced Andy Curran to the club as a potential owner.

Shareholders and supporters did not trust Currans plans one bit, and , following a lengthy battle, he too was seen off back to Essex (or is it North Africa or Spain?)

Finally, another ghoul appeared in the form of Matt Southall, but it appears he was full of piss and wind as well.


The club has now issued more shares to genuine supporters, and has a brand new Board of Directors running things.
We are struggling financially as ever... but we think it's a sustainable model for the future and we are not in debt. we have a new squad of youngsters, players cutting their teeth in league football and a couple of old hands. It's far far far preferable to the Salfords of this world who are living way beyond their sustainable means.


The ex CEO; David Roger Bottomley, has now been sniffing around other jobs in football, but be warned... he is NOT to be trusted at any cost, and investigations of his running of Dale are ongoing as there may have been some questionable decisions taken under his watch to say the least.


Sorry it's a long reply; but the truth needs putting into the public domain as often as we can.

 

[Valeite]

The academy costs around £800,000 a year to run so in simplistic terms we have to sell a player for that amount every year for it to break even.

I suppose it is easier to bring young players into the team in league 2 than in league 1 to give them time to develop before you get promoted and can get more money when you sell them after proving themselves at league 1 level. So is it worth watching this season as it seems the club has decided to relegate itself?

 

[Bottega Don]

The recent off field problems were caused mainly by the old CEO, who is a cretin. He was voted off the Board together with another Director at our June AGM.

Those two, together with a couple of large shareholders, had plotted to sell the club (whilst they looked to profit from the sale of their shares) to an outside investor, who planned to borrow against the ground to finance it all.

This was blocked by shareholders, and the ex CEO then introduced Andy Curran to the club as a potential owner.

Shareholders and supporters did not trust Currans plans one bit, and , following a lengthy battle, he too was seen off back to Essex (or is it North Africa or Spain?)

Finally, another ghoul appeared in the form of Matt Southall, but it appears he was full of piss and wind as well.


The club has now issued more shares to genuine supporters, and has a brand new Board of Directors running things.
We are struggling financially as ever... but we think it's a sustainable model for the future and we are not in debt. we have a new squad of youngsters, players cutting their teeth in league football and a couple of old hands. It's far far far preferable to the Salfords of this world who are living way beyond their sustainable means.


The ex CEO; David Roger Bottomley, has now been sniffing around other jobs in football, but be warned... he is NOT to be trusted at any cost, and investigations of his running of Dale are ongoing as there may have been some questionable decisions taken under his watch to say the least.


Sorry it's a long reply; but the truth needs putting into the public domain as often as we can.

I read this article earlier https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58883213

Thats what I was basing my point on, I hope you don't get dragged into trouble but I know like off the field distractions can often translate to on the pitch.

 

[kieran_vale]

I can only base it off when I saw Rochdale against us but I thought they were a more than decent side and were good value in the end for their win. Had a very good number 9 and a lad on the wing who caused us no end of grief.

I did think at the start of the season that off field turmoil could be a problem (as has happened with Oldham) and just hope it has stabilised now as they are a good club.

 

[valefan16]

I can only base it off when I saw Rochdale against us but I thought they were a more than decent side and were good value in the end for their win. Had a very good number 9 and a lad on the wing who caused us no end of grief.

I did think at the start of the season that off field turmoil could be a problem (as has happened with Oldham) and just hope it has stabilised now as they are a good club.

So far aside from Scunthorpe I would be somewhat nervous if I was a Colchester fan, their xG is bad again like it was last season and that eventually translated into the results after a good start.

They were terrible at the weekend, long ball to Nouble with Sears looking for scraps but dont like like scoring goals. (9 all season) and despite a decent overall defensive record were all over the place at VP.

 

[Agombar stool]

So far aside from Scunthorpe I would be somewhat nervous if I was a Colchester fan, their xG is bad again like it was last season and that eventually translated into the results after a good start.

They were terrible at the weekend, long ball to Nouble with Sears looking for scraps but dont like like scoring goals. (9 all season) and despite a decent overall defensive record were all over the place at VP.

Colchester were comfortably the worst side we've played this season. Of course we drew 0-0 with them. Definitely 2 points dropped. Actually they were on par with Bristol Rovers, forgot about them.

 

[Chris FGR]

Stevenage were pretty dire when we played them. Scunthorpe were better then expected.

 

[Robshep]

Colchester were comfortably the worst side we've played this season. Of course we drew 0-0 with them. Definitely 2 points dropped. Actually they were on par with Bristol Rovers, forgot about them.

The fact they signed half of a mid table League 1 Ipswich team from last season and are struggling is a massive indictment of the quality of English football.

 

[valefan16]

The fact they signed half of a mid table League 1 Ipswich team from last season and are struggling is a massive indictment of the quality of English football.

A fan on our forum made a point that their defence is pretty old so wasn't on Saturday much pace to it which against Wilson, Politic and Rodney with Gibbons and Worrall overlapping was always going to be messy, it didn't look to have any pace at all to deal with us (and imagine most dynamic attacking threats at this level).

Probably would do ok against a side playing long ball to a big man but didnt seem to have the tools for it against our style.

 

[Robshep]

A fan on our forum made a point that their defence is pretty old so wasn't on Saturday much pace to it which against Wilson, Politic and Rodney with Gibbons and Worrall overlapping was always going to be messy, it didn't look to have any pace at all to deal with us (and imagine most dynamic attacking threats at this level).

Probably would do ok against a side playing long ball to a big man but didnt seem to have the tools for it against our style.

Even we scored 2 against them without a penalty.

 

[Salvador]

I read this article earlier https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58883213

Thats what I was basing my point on, I hope you don't get dragged into trouble but I know like off the field distractions can often translate to on the pitch.

I read this article earlier https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58883213

Thats what I was basing my point on, I hope you don't get dragged into trouble but I know like off the field distractions can often translate to on the pitch.

We won’t go down. We actually have a half decent squad and for a run of 6-7 games earlier in the season looked shit hot. A case of when we’d score not if. Off the field stuff has been a distraction I’m sure but seems to be put to bed now. I stand by my prediction of a play off place by end of season. Not seen an outstandingly poor or good side yet. Of the teams we’ve played so far the stand out worst for me would be Sutton, Colchester and Salford. Though I temper that with Sutton were a man down for 45. Salford just looked such a blunt side. Maybe my view jaded by my expectation they’d be half decent. Colchester we’re gifted a goal at ours via OG. Scunny, Mansfield, Oldham (all apparently relegation threatened) looked alright to me.

 

[Vanni]

Rochdale will be fine I think and it takes a brave man to put money on Mansfield for the drop as I don't think their owner would accept relegation without doing everything in his power (£££) to stop that from happening.

Salvador said and I quote 'Not seen an outstandingly poor or good side yet'. I won't comment on the poor sides but I have long held the belief that you don't need to be outstandingly good to go up. I think it's all about the ability to bounce back after a bad result. See FGR for instance - they were defeated by Swindon on their patch then won at Scunny 7 days later. Then their response to a 1-1 draw at Orient was a 3-1 home win over Salford. Port Vale's another good example. A loss at Sutton was followed by a win over Barrow and then another win over Col U after they had dropped 2 points at Stags. I think you can where I'm going with this.

 

[Bottega Don]

I think our only saving grace at the moment is that our players seem to care and be up for it. Our players have only really given up in one game (Harrogate), this time last season they'd already given up in about 5 games. On Saturday our players wanted it a lot more than Crawley and showed real fight in the FGR home game despite some abhorrent decisions going against them.

We have by far the weakest quality side and the most tactically inept manager so I don't hold out much hope but if we do manage to somehow stay up then it'll solely be on our players wanting it more than others.

 

[shoddycollins]

I think our only saving grace at the moment is that our players seem to care and be up for it. Our players have only really given up in one game (Harrogate), this time last season they'd already given up in about 5 games. On Saturday our players wanted it a lot more than Crawley and showed real fight in the FGR home game despite some abhorrent decisions going against them.

We have by far the weakest quality side and the most tactically inept manager so I don't hold out much hope but if we do manage to somehow stay up then it'll solely be on our players wanting it more than others.

Something about the way you caved when we pulled a goal back the other week looked to me like the sign of a team who weren't up for it, but maybe you've shown a lot more fight in other games.

 

[Bottega Don]

Something about the way you caved when we pulled a goal back the other week looked to me like the sign of a team who weren't up for it, but maybe you've shown a lot more fight in other games.

That's the Neil Cox special.

He sees that the team looks comfortable and doesn't look like conceding, he proceeds to throw everyone behind the ball and make unnecessary subs which invite pressure. With the lack of quality, we are bound to concede if we are having balls pumped into the box.

 

[dedwardp]

Yeah, it's not looking good for us at the moment. I thought our recruitment was ok in the summer - nothing spectacular, but not too bad. As much as the Ipswich fans laughed, those players were part of a side that finished ninth in League One so they should have enough for a steady League Two season but they've all been pretty shocking so far. We are incapable of scoring goals and look as bad as we did last year.

If it wasn't for Shamal George so far then we'd be bottom at the moment.

 

[Salvador]

Rochdale will be fine I think and it takes a brave man to put money on Mansfield for the drop as I don't think their owner would accept relegation without doing everything in his power (£££) to stop that from happening.

Salvador said and I quote 'Not seen an outstandingly poor or good side yet'. I won't comment on the poor sides but I have long held the belief that you don't need to be outstandingly good to go up. I think it's all about the ability to bounce back after a bad result. See FGR for instance - they were defeated by Swindon on their patch then won at Scunny 7 days later. Then their response to a 1-1 draw at Orient was a 3-1 home win over Salford. Port Vale's another good example. A loss at Sutton was followed by a win over Barrow and then another win over Col U after they had dropped 2 points at Stags. I think you can where I'm going with this.

I agree with that. I suppose it’s the same in any league but this one more than others that a good run of form means the most in terms of success. Put 3 wins together in league 2 and you’ll climb the table quickly.

 

[Mighty Mornflake]

I suppose it is easier to bring young players into the team in league 2 than in league 1 to give them time to develop before you get promoted and can get more money when you sell them after proving themselves at league 1 level. So is it worth watching this season as it seems the club has decided to relegate itself?

I'm quite sure the last thing the club wants is to be relegated.
We'll stay up,I think.
Perhaps not by much.

 

[Essex2Wessex]

My impression so far is that there seems to be a bit more of a divide between the top teams in this division and those that aren't at least play-off contenders than was the case last season, at least. We've played a few capable and confident teams - Swindon probably the best of them, but Vale, Tranmere up there too, with Exeter and Northampton not far behind. But, conversely, I'm not sure there are any obviously piss-poor teams with no future in the league. At this stage in the season, even the weakest teams we've faced have been way stronger than Southend last year, Stevenage the year before, or Yeovil the year before that, who did more or less fit that description.

I'd still be surprised if Scunny don't go down, but that is at least as much to do with off-field issues as the capability of their players. They're not great, but they also aren't shockingly dreadful. Granted Southend last year were spectacularly hopeless (but still beat us...) and their fate seemed sealed from day one. Scunthorpe at least aren't quite in this situation. But I'm not sure now I'd care to bet on the other relegation probable. Carlisle have strengths that require fine tuning, Oldham, despite their deranged ownership, have balls and spirit and creativity (as they did last year), Mansfield surely just need, somehow, to get a grip, while the other teams talked about early season as potentially National League-bound (principally Sutton and Hartlepool) have pretty much proved they aren't.

Obviously I'd love Salford to go down (however improbable), but Stevenage might be a possibility. We won't be hearing from their fans on here in either case...

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

Any manager who decides to play long ball with the players we’ve got cannot call themselves half decent. If we do get a half decent manager I’m sure he’ll either make a couple of free agents signings that suit long ball or he’ll play to our current squads limited strengths.

I have never understood this big call from Carlisle fans about a ‘passing team’

it’s very rare to get a good passing team down here I seen it about once at Carlisle and that was Mervyn Day’s side back in 1997 which played 5-3-2 passed the ball superbly but it takes a real luck of having the right players to fit it and more so goals all over the pitch. If you don’t have defenders and midfielders dangerous in attack it won’t work

the crucial factor to the new manager isn’t a ‘we need to try passing it as have the wrong players’ approach it’s going to find them players and having the contacts for it…….while maybe short term playing some basic style to scrape you through to improvements.

carlisle without me watching them right now simply need exactly what Paul Simpson needed when he took over…….A Kevin Grey and Andy Preece a double whammy to strengthen a pathetic spine.

just passing it will solve nowt, they still have a pathetic back line you can walk through and no one causing any issues at their defence.

 

[hellogregory]

Just passing it won’t solve everything, but while we have this squad it’s the best option for us. All pumping it long achieves with this team is gifting the ball straight back to the opposition as we simply don’t have anyone capable of winning headers or holding the ball up.

So until January comes, yes we have to be a passing team.

Agree about us needing a Preece type and a dominant powerful central defender. Another Aaron Hayden or Rhys Bennett would be perfect.

 

[hellogregory]

Carlisle United may well be going down, but hellogregory won’t be.

If the club gets relegated to that cesspit of a league, hellogregory will not be making the move down to the non league forum. No chance.

 

[BarraMatt]

Carlisle United may well be going down, but hellogregory won’t be.

If the club gets relegated to that cesspit of a league, hellogregory will not be making the move down to the non league forum. No chance.

It's actually far more entertaining than this section to be fair.