Carlisle United billionaire fake-over

[BigDaveCUFC]

They will have to hope we do not have the start we have had the last 3 seasons or they may well be in for a lot of abuse at home matches, you sort've get the feeling that apathy we've had for 3 years is beginning to turn into frustration and anger now.

although we surely cannot have 4 horrendous starts in a row.

 

[shoddycollins]

Well this is proof the whole thing is fucked.

http://www.carlisleunited.co.uk/news/article/club-statement-dated-17-july-2015-2552795.aspx

For those who don't want to read the whole thing, basically this is an official statement from the club, fucking Andrew Lapping off, casting doubt on the veracity of his plan, accusing him of shady business practices, and generally saying his proposed investment plan is no longer being considered by the club.

The billionaire isn't mentioned, and hasn't been for a while.

Nothing left to look forward to besides a quinoia cous-cous at Forest Green next season (providing they don't come up to League 2)

 

[chairboyexile]

sounds like CUFCltd did the right thing and walked away from a crook

 

[shoddycollins]

sounds like CUFCltd did the right thing and walked away from a crook

They claim he's a crook. They don't have any evidence of it, and he seemed to do a pretty good job when he ran Motherwell. They just don't like the fact that he engages with the fans and is open about what his plans are. That isn't the Carlisle United way.

 

[daviejones]

They claim he's a crook. They don't have any evidence of it, and he seemed to do a pretty good job when he ran Motherwell. They just don't like the fact that he engages with the fans and is open about what his plans are. That isn't the Carlisle United way.

Very good point made by CCU on our board:
"If you seriously think the Club would release such a scathing rebuttal, without valid reason, then you don't understand business!

Like it or not, they've said AL hasn't got anywhere near the coin needed, rumours of which have circulated for a good while (I raised the very matter when this Board began!).

Had to be true or they'd leave themselves open to Legal Action?!"

Lapping obviously told a few porkies somewhere along the line or else we wouldn't be able to make such claims. Got to move on from him now, no matter how attractive his proposal looked.

 

[cufc17]

But why has it taken them this long to release a statement? What'll happen now is anyone's guess.

Of course Nixon would have to stay on to 'handle Football League and FA duties' too.

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

bottom 5 for us this season.....too much negative behind scenes stuff

this is them just fobbing off that billionairre crap no one believed in anyway

can we get new owners over this season and can we survive relegation.

 

[chairboyexile]

bottom 5 for us this season.....too much negative behind scenes stuff

this is them just fobbing off that billionairre crap no one believed in anyway

can we get new owners over this season and can we survive relegation.

At least you will be above us

 

[Alan Partridge]

Shock.

The two old boys must think we're a bunch of doylems. This is just a statement to confirm on the sly that there is no mystery investor, hence why they're trying to appease the fans by having a bullshit shake-up.

Fuck giving them anymore of my coin, I'll stick to away games 'til they're gone.

 

[shoddycollins]

For the benefit of those other fans who have been following this thread, but aren't aware of the full story, here is the situation so far.

In 2008 the club changes ownership from Fred Story to a consortium of local businessmen (the current owners), who were previously directors of the club. While I don't wish to create too rose-tinted a view of the Story era (he had his critics), under his ownership the club went from the Conference to League One playoffs in only 3 seasons. As a property developer, people did question is motives, but he was also apparently a fan of the club. When he sold the club, he left a £1.1m debt to himself, although this had no repayment plan.

Under the current owners, who referred to themselves as merely 'custodians' until a new owner could be found to invest, the club has slid steadily backwards. It's not really about the lack of investment; chairman Andrew Jenkins (who has sat on the board since the 1950s) has had to dip his hands in his pockets to keep the club on a even financial keel on multiple occasions. The main problems fans have had with the current board is a lack of forward thinking, old-fashioned business practices with lots of confidentiality and gentleman's agreements (such as the decision to offer Greg Abbott a new contract after the club narrowly avoided relegation because they'd told him 12 months ago they'd offer him one, only to sack him a month into the new season). MD John Nixon has also been criticised for the amount of interest he has shown in furthering his career within the Football League; during our time in League One, he was the division's representative on the FL board.

There has been something of an obsession with Blue Yonder, their plans for a new stadium. Fans are pretty divided on the issue, some argue the club needs a modern stadium to move forward, others are worried about the club moving to a soulless out-of-town Meccano stadium. Most fans though are frustrated with the lack of transparency (there has been a confidential agreement with a developer to build it for a few years now), and concerned about the possibility of the stadium being constructed to benefit the interests of some property developer or retail park owner rather than the club. Others also feel this is pie-in-the-sky talk with the club unable to even find a suitable location, which distracts from more urgent concerns.

The dissatisfaction reached a tipping point with relegation to League Two in 2013. Many felt that new ideas were necessary (more so than new investment, though both would be nice) to halt the slide, and all we were getting was talk of mythical future stadia from Nixon, and attempts to placate the fans by issuing statements through Jenkins (who remained broadly popular among fans, even if many felt new ideas were needed). This is where Andrew Lapping comes in. A local businessman and fan with experience in football administration he approached the club with plans to remove obstacles to investment, restructure the club and bring in new investment. Lapping himself wasn't putting a lot of money in, but was able to lead a consortium of local business owners to make an investment. His main achievements were negotiating with Fred Story to write off the debt (Lapping himself credits Nixon with the negotiation, but to enter negotiations was Lapping's idea) and getting the agreement of the Trust to dilute their share in order to make room for new investment.

After a tough season it looks like we were just dotting the i's and crossing the t's and would have new investment and a new structure by the start of the 2015/16 season. A new board was to be appointed with high-quality salaried executives to drive the club forwards, while Jenkins and Nixon would join Lapping and the other investors on the board of the holding company, setting strategic targets and overseeing the new board. Of this all that happened was the appointment of a new commercial director. A managing director was about to be appointed when things stalled.

In May, the club announced a new investor had come forward with a plan to buy the club and they felt duty bound to listen to the new proposal. Lapping's plans were put on hold, we entered talks with the investor who was later revealed to be a foreign billionaire. Until recently, only Nixon and Jenkins on the current board even knew the investor's identity (although apparently the board members from the Trust have now been let in on the loop). Things however have moved pretty slowly, with only sporadic reports that someone has met with the investor (or the investor's representatives), and vague reassurances that the investor is carrying out due diligence.

However in the last couple of weeks the club have first announced that it could take a long time for the investor to make up their mind (up to a year) while also announcing that Lapping's plan has now been officially abandoned, casting doubt on his ability to raise the money required and criticising his business practices.

Now with less than a month to go to the start of the new season things look even less certain than before. It seems most likely that nothing much is going to change, and we will certainly not be seeing any new investment in the club. Mr Curle will have a job on his hands to improve our situation from the relegation battle he inherited when he took over.

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

on the plus for me its saved me 20 odd quid as I am not bothering with the friendlies now....got myself a nice Kinect thing instead....was good.

its a bizarre summer so far, on one hand am going back for first time properly in 3 seasons on other hand I simply have got out of watching football now and have zero sort've interest, the current news, a bland team and a bland manager, horrendous PR, apathy filled fanbase etc, etc havn't quite helped me pick up interest

I think had I not already got the ST and was paying to go i'd not bothered............wonder if that does end up way for them who pay on day instead of getting ST's.............be an interesting first game crowd vs Cambridge, should be hitting the 6-7,000....if it doesn't it says a lot.

 

[hellogregory]

on the plus for me its saved me 20 odd quid as I am not bothering with the friendlies now....got myself a nice Kinect thing instead....was good.

its a bizarre summer so far, on one hand am going back for first time properly in 3 seasons on other hand I simply have got out of watching football now and have zero sort've interest, the current news, a bland team and a bland manager, horrendous PR, apathy filled fanbase etc, etc havn't quite helped me pick up interest

I think had I not already got the ST and was paying to go i'd not bothered............wonder if that does end up way for them who pay on day instead of getting ST's.............be an interesting first game crowd vs Cambridge, should be hitting the 6-7,000....if it doesn't it says a lot.

Think that all hinges on what happens at Field Mill the week before. A good win at Mansfield followed by a decent performance in the cup and we may get a reasonable 6000-7000 crowd. A defeat at Mansfield and it will be 4000.

 

[Pooliekev]

You'll get a result at Mansfield.

They haven't got Rakish Bingham anymore.

All joking apart though, I do sympathise with Carlisle's plight.

It's bloody awful when you know the present board want out and you don't know if some shady crew are waiting to pounce.

 

[Glasshalffullpools]

It's dragging on a bit this now ,.either theres a buyer or there isn't

 

[shoddycollins]

It's dragging on a bit this now ,.either theres a buyer or there isn't

I think we'll never know. Now the announcement fobbing off Lapping is out there they've no need for spurious tales of mystery illionaires.

 

[shoddycollins]

It's dragging on a bit this now ,.either theres a buyer or there isn't

Your comment must have stirred them into action because they've released some more 'news'.

http://www.newsandstar.co.uk/carlis...le-utd-know-identity-of-billionaire-1.1223507

I say 'news' in quotation marks because I'm not really sure that can be considered news. Good news I suppose to hear that the board reorganisation is still going ahead, Nixon will still be replaced by a new MD, and interesting if not particularly encouraging to hear Jenkins elaborate a bit on their reasons for preferring Lapping over the billionaire.

I'm not sure whether there's much in their comments on his suitability as a person, I know there are a few United fans who felt similar, such as Davie Jones who posted his views further up. I don't think they've said anything especially libellous, it's a bit of a vague criticism, they don't seem to have accused him of anything specific, which I why I'm not as certain as Davie if there's any substance to their claims. There just seemed to be a different culture between theirs of confidentiality and Lapping's openness, the same openness that had the majority of fans backing him.

However Jenkins comments do seem to suggest that money is the biggest factor after all, and that he does fear administration (and I suppose he more than anyone will know exactly how much longer he can keep bankrolling the club for). Lapping's plan would have invested less than £2 million, it was more about new faces and new ways of doing things, which most fans thought was for the best. We don't know what the mystery billionaire's ways of doing things are (lots of confidentiality though I'm sure) and there will be lots of speculation on whether it will be in the club's interests, or whether it will even materialise; but Jenkins seems of the believe that £1.6 million is nowhere near enough to sustain a football club.

At least he's changed his tune from speculating that if we went down to the Conference we might make a nice little non-league club.

 

[cufc17]

http://www.carlisleunited.co.uk/new...kins-on-ongoing-investment-talks-2574555.aspx

Yet another statement which tells us precisely nothing, though he claims talks have reached the next stage.

 

[Alan Partridge]

Another statement telling us, er, nothing...

What will the next say?

 

[shoddycollins]

Sir Humphrey Appleby could learn a thing or two from our bods.

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

I am just thankful we've got out of the last stage of the first parts to progress it to the current stage of the second parts so that the stage of the first parts can link with the stage of the second parts, probably turn into the stage of the third parts but may yet return to the stage of the first parts if the second parts doesn't hit the correct sections of the first and second parts which interlink for the third parts parts.

but I recommend new billionaires every summer...............certainly makes it more interesting than normal pre-seasons.

 

[shoddycollins]

I am just thankful we've got out of the last stage of the first parts to progress it to the current stage of the second parts so that the stage of the first parts can link with the stage of the second parts, probably turn into the stage of the third parts but may yet return to the stage of the first parts if the second parts doesn't hit the correct sections of the first and second parts which interlink for the third parts parts.

but I recommend new billionaires every summer...............certainly makes it more interesting than normal pre-seasons.

We will progress from the preliminary outlining phase of stage two at the appropriate juncture, in due course, in the fullness of time. Until then the billionaire's proposals are under consideration... if things fall into place, following a period of due diligence then they may even progress to being under active consideration. Only at this point will someone write a memo stating briefly what the process of moving to stage two proper might, dependent on many factors, look to be like... without mentioning timescales of course.

What on Earth to fans of other football clubs that don't have mystery billionaires to chat about occupy themselves with during the season? Surely not football.

 

[cufc17]

http://mobile.carlisleunited.co.uk/...-john-nixon-steps-down-from-role-2585007.aspx

Okay, so John Nixon (Managing Director) has officially stepped down from his position on the Board, but in truth he's still going to be involved at the club as he remains on the board of CUFC Holdings. He'll continue to liasie between Keith Curle and the operational side of the business, too.

 

[Alan Partridge]

Just look at him, the fat-jawed divvy...

 

[shoddycollins]

http://mobile.carlisleunited.co.uk/...-john-nixon-steps-down-from-role-2585007.aspx

Okay, so John Nixon (Managing Director) has officially stepped down from his position on the Board, but in truth he's still going to be involved at the club as he remains on the board of CUFC Holdings. He'll continue to liasie between Keith Curle and the operational side of the business, too.

Keith Curle will love that I'm sure. Although maybe things aren't so bad in that department since Curle stopped Nixon coming into the dressing room after the game.

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

This news all over our forums the last 2 days is very very very worrying.

me thinks the on field stuff will not matter, we may have to instead push the off-field stuff before a disastrous mistake is made which will destroy the club.

but people need to be careful about what they write here sadly so cannot reveal much apart from the serious links coming to this investor stuff is someone who I do not want near this club in any way, shape or form.

 

[Habbinalan]

This news all over our forums the last 2 days is very very very worrying.

me thinks the on field stuff will not matter, we may have to instead push the off-field stuff before a disastrous mistake is made which will destroy the club.

but people need to be careful about what they write here sadly so cannot reveal much apart from the serious links coming to this investor stuff is someone who I do not want near this club in any way, shape or form.

I speak in general terms when I say that it's quite frustrating trying to keep up with developments and prospects at my third club. You have my heartfelt commiserations for the situation and in particular mix of individuals that potentially faces your/our club. It brings back memories of our darkest days at the Abbey. The combination of opportunist chancers and well meaning but possibly out-of-depth directors is a dangerous one. Although we escaped the clutches of the chancers, despite the rosy picture we can paint at the moment, Cambridge United lost ownership of the ground when we went down to the Conference and are still not complete masters of our own destiny.

Oyston is the name at the front of most football fans minds at the moment but this brings to mind articles in the News & Star in April and Manchester Evening News back in 2013 - which seem to have been published with no legal repercussions.

".......Yet right now, whatever the arguments, 316 from a fanbase of thousands still make all the noise of a pea rattling in a tin. So at this imminent time of change a golden opportunity to come in from the margins has to be seized – and certainly the big decisions cannot afford to be swayed by noisy backbenchers such as Agar, a former Mileson ally whose past involvement at clubs like Scarborough, Gretna, Stockport County and York City does not necessarily suggest possession of a road-map to lasting prosperity...."

http://www.newsandstar.co.uk/carlis...st-s-awkward-squad-need-to-get-real-1.1202165

".........Mr Fearn had gone on record to describe an approach to the club from ‘a fantasist’ – though some fans were left wondering why Wildes’ apparent bid had been dismissed.

“Paul Wildes never approached us; it was Keith Agar (County’s former managing director) who approached us,” Mr Fearn explained.

“We had a bid of £30,000 for the club; he wanted to take it on and repay the loans when County were back in the Championship.

“He (Agar) said it was from Paul Wildes but we never heard from him; if he had come in then I’d have been quite open to hear what he had to say....."

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...ing-vice-chairman-spencer-fearn-heard-3815171

I'm sure that your board will be able to see a sensible path forward in due course but hope that events (manipulated or otherwise) don't overtake them in the meantime.

 

[BigDaveCUFC]

Just be careful with posting on it Habbinalan seems most are being quite careful, but newspaper links are good way around it.

more and more you see about it, the more and more you think our board are moronic to be involved

 

[shoddycollins]

Yes, one of the men being discussed in this thread and others on Carlisle United fans forums is famously litigious. I know of at least four Carlisle fans who have now been threatened with legal action, either directly because he knows their identity, or indirectly because he claims to know their identity but doesn't know shit.

On one occasion a fan recieved a call from somebody's lawyers after making a throwaway comment about a forum user, despite that fan having neither stated who he thought the forum user was, or even known who others were claiming that forum user was. The person doing the threatening was denying using the forum at the same time as threatening someone with legal action for making a comment about a forum user.

Many men have been discussed in the many threads about this subject... I could be referring to anyone for all anyone else knows.

 

[Habbinalan]

Yes, one of the men being discussed in this thread and others on Carlisle United fans forums is famously litigious. I know of at least four Carlisle fans who have now been threatened with legal action, either directly because he knows their identity, or indirectly because he claims to know their identity but doesn't know shit.

On one occasion a fan recieved a call from somebody's lawyers after making a throwaway comment about a forum user, despite that fan having neither stated who he thought the forum user was, or even known who others were claiming that forum user was. The person doing the threatening was denying using the forum at the same time as threatening someone with legal action for making a comment about a forum user.

Many men have been discussed in the many threads about this subject... I could be referring to anyone for all anyone else knows.

.......and I shall quietly retreat into the crowd until the need to express empathy (or raspberries) arises again.

 

[shoddycollins]

errr.
http://www.newsandstar.co.uk/carlis...o-comment-on-pattison-twitter-gaffe-1.1226839

1) I thought Pattison was no longer a director. Why is he still described as director of football?
2) Yeah, when I heard of a message from 'Keith' my first reaction was 'that won't be Keith Curle' too.